And a conclusion: Icing reduces one's safety margin considerably. Paddling in such cold weather is an interesting experiment, but I don't recommend it for extended trips. ----------------- Interesting comments. Have you (or anyone else) ever had the nerve to walk into the water and submerge yourself in your drysuit before or after a paddle in that kind of weather? I feel I have to do that before my first cold paddle because a) I want to know in general what it's really like in a controlled situation and b) to ensure I have enough insulation. I'm still trying to get my latex neck gasket to fit without passing out though. I think it's stretched about as far as it's going to. I've got it wrapped around a gallon paint can with 4 paperbacks around the can and an entire Sunday paper between the can and the paperbacks. I suspect I might have to go find the scissors. I've been going slow in the effort because once cut, duct tape probably won't work to put the gasket back together :-). Right now, I think I'm more concerned about my hands in a dump situation than the poor ol' bod. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ *************************************************************************** *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Sisler, Clyde wrote: > I'm still trying to get my latex neck gasket to fit without passing out > though. I think it's stretched about as far as it's going to. I've got it > wrapped around a gallon paint can with 4 paperbacks around the can and an > entire Sunday paper between the can and the paperbacks. I suspect I might > have to go find the scissors. I've been going slow in the effort because > once cut, duct tape probably won't work to put the gasket back together :-). Well, I know of one paddler who at the start of trip found that the neck gasket had finally deteriorated with age. She just ducted taped the good part of the latex to her bare neck for a proper seal. Now that is a TOUGH paddler!!! ralph diaz ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024 Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com "Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com wrote: > > Well, I know of one paddler who at the start of trip found that the neck > gasket had finally deteriorated with age. She just ducted taped the > good part of the latex to her bare neck for a proper seal. Now that is > a TOUGH paddler!!! > Been there, done that. Not too bad except when you try to look behind you or when you roll. And at the take-out, of course. Steve -- Test Scoring & Reporting Services Sometimes, you never can University of Georgia always tell what you Athens, GA 30602-5593 least expect the most. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
It requires proper attire rather than nerve to take the plunge. I admit that I have never jumped in the water when it was 8 degrees above, but I have swam in my drysuit for fun on several winter paddles when it was in the 20s and 30s. Our club web page has a photo of me swimming with my paddle on last years New Years day event with the caption "Where is my boat?". To respond to this clear attempt at slander - for the record I must state that it was not the result of a capsize, but instead I was paddling about the Mississippi doing crawl and back stroke with my paddle for fun. The year before that we had the imfamous battle of the berg. When a small ice chunk drifted by one of club members swam out and climbed on top, and soon it was king of the berg time - at least until they discovered that the little chuck of ice had a safe capacity of less than three kayakers, and it promptly flipped over! A few suggestions on dressing for very cold water. Protecting your head, your hands, and your feet are the biggest challenges. I have a Kokatat Gortex drysuit with the built in latex booties. For years I just used ankle gaskets and dive boots, but once you try warm dry socks under drysuit booties with neoprene dive boots over top you will never go back to ankel gaskets and wet cold feet! For my head I prefer a Gortex and fleece Elmer Fudd style hat that wraps tight around my chin. Even when I roll it stays surprisingly dry and I find it warmer and much more comfortable than a neoprene dive hood. Obviously in rough water or during a prolonged swim it likely would get too wet to be warm so I have a dive hood in my PFD pocket as a backup. I have yet to find a pair of gloves that keeps my hands warm while giving me acceptable paddle feel. For this reason I prefer to use Pogies and a wood paddle to keep my hands toasty warm. The Pogies ice on to the paddle but I have nothing between my fingers and a nice warm paddle shaft (fiberglass or graphite shafts are colder, and plastic covered aluminum shafts are really icy cold!). When swimming I keep my hands in my pogies and swim with my paddle and try to keep my head high and dry if possible. I the event of a real capsize the biggest problem would be quickly using my bare hands to do any operations that required dexterity and then warming them again in the Pogies. I always use a paddle leash so I can keep in contact with my boat even if both hands are in my Pogies and on my paddle. The one big advantage to neoprene gloves is that you may be able to keep your hands protected while fiddling with gear. Unfortunately most gloves don't allow for much dexterity so your gear needs to be set up so you can work it easily with hand while wearing these despicable Monster Paws. Finding and pulling the grab loop on your spray skirt can be hard to do with gloves also (see previous paddlewise postings on putting a wiffle golf ball on the loop etc.) What ever system you use I recomend trying a capsize under controlled conditions and doing a self rescue in winter conditions (Make sure you have a warm car or better still a nice Sauna waiting in case your clothes, and gear are not up to the task!) Sisler, Clyde wrote: > And a conclusion: Icing reduces one's safety margin > considerably. Paddling in such cold weather is an interesting > experiment, but I don't recommend it for extended trips. > > ----------------- > > Interesting comments. Have you (or anyone else) ever had the nerve to walk > into the water and submerge yourself in your drysuit before or after a > paddle in that kind of weather? > > I feel I have to do that before my first cold paddle because a) I want to > know in general what it's really like in a controlled situation and b) to > ensure I have enough insulation. > > I'm still trying to get my latex neck gasket to fit without passing out > though. I think it's stretched about as far as it's going to. I've got it > wrapped around a gallon paint can with 4 paperbacks around the can and an > entire Sunday paper between the can and the paperbacks. I suspect I might > have to go find the scissors. I've been going slow in the effort because > once cut, duct tape probably won't work to put the gasket back together :-). > > Right now, I think I'm more concerned about my hands in a dump situation > than the poor ol' bod. > > *************************************************************************** > PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List > Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net > Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net > Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ > *************************************************************************** > *************************************************************************** > PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List > Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net > Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net > Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ > *************************************************************************** *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
wanewman_at_uswest.net wrote: > this reason I prefer to use Pogies and a wood paddle to keep my hands toasty > warm. The Pogies ice on to the paddle but I have nothing between my fingers and > a nice warm paddle shaft (fiberglass or graphite shafts are colder, and plastic > covered aluminum shafts are really icy cold!). I earlier reproduced a sidebar from a back issue of my newsletter concerning how Gail Ferris used a hoe and flexible plastic sheet kid's sled to cope with ice situations. In the main story was a mention of something else she did to make paddling more comfortable. She shoved insulation into the shaft of her fiberglass paddle (I think she had either a San Juan or Camano from Werner). She claimed that this kept the shaft from feeling cold against her hands. Thinking back, I believe you would to first have to remove the snap button temporarily to get insulation past it. This, of course, would only work with a breakapart paddle. I forgot what she used for insulation but anything that would not absorb water and could stay in place should work. As for the issue of using pogies and risking the problem of having bare hands during a rescue (for attaching sprayskirt, etc.), there are some real light flexible neoprene gloves on the market. In and of themselves they would not really give you enough warmth when paddling in cold weather but used in conjunction with pogies they would give you the best of both worlds: warmth and comfort while paddling: a modicum of hand warmth for effecting rescue tasks. The kind I mean is generally found in the fishing tackle section of sports shops. Cost around $20. Buy them on the large size for your hand to assure lots of flex. Depending on amount of use, they should last several seasons. They beat the heavy neoprene gloves found in paddle shops which need to be pre-curved and all that to have any amount of comfort and minimal hand restriction. ralph diaz -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024 Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com "Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com wrote: > As for the issue of using pogies and risking the problem of having bare > hands during a rescue (for attaching sprayskirt, etc.), there are some > real light flexible neoprene gloves on the market. In and of themselves > they would not really give you enough warmth when paddling in cold > weather but used in conjunction with pogies they would give you the best > of both worlds: warmth and comfort while paddling: a modicum of hand > warmth for effecting rescue tasks. Anyone try the Seal Skinz in this manner? I've heard good and bad things about them. I've been wandering about how good they'd be (compared to neoprene) once flooded. I guess one advantage over the neoprene is a bit of breathability. Mike *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
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