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From: Matt Broze <mkayaks_at_oz.net> subject: [Paddlewise] Instability with a flooded cockpit (and more added) Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 01:00:23 -0800 · This archive was generated by hypermail 2.4.0 : Thu Aug 21 2025 - 16:33:07 PDT

A reenter and roll does not stabilize the kayak for pumping out afterwards
(like the paddle float can if the paddle is fastened to the kayak). Why not
learn to do both and use what is most appropriate for your situation rather
than embracing one and dismissing the other. I encourage paddlers to learn
the reenter and roll (you can even use a paddle float to help). Just be sure
you don't think this or any rescue works well until you have also pumped out
the kayak after getting back upright again in some rough water. BTW I have
no trouble pumping out through the waist tube and in front of the seat with
an 18" long hand pump. (a T at the bottom can even make it a one handed
operation but with a fixed outrigger paddle float two handed is no problem).
I get leg cramps using foot pumps and have seen several electric pumps fail.
An electric pump backed up by a hand pump would probably be my choice if I
capsized a lot and wasn't very good at rolling. Electric's are a lot less
complicated to install than a foot pump too.  Eddyline used to make one as a
unit with a battery pack, maybe they still do.
You might not need to pump if you use a sea sock (or anything that leaves
little room in the cockpit area) so the kayak floats higher in the water
after a capsize and therefore the cockpit doesn't dig as deep and scoop up
as much water when you right it. Less water scooped in means less free water
sloshing around to destabilize you and less to pump out if you still need
to.  Since the sea-sock is pulled down vertically from the edge of the
cockpit  when you sit in it the freewater in it can't slosh as far to the
side either. The sea sock does not need to be fastened to the bulkhead (or
even under the deck) to hold it in place. The vacuum created behind it (if
you try to pull it out you will find you can't move it much) will keep it in
place. Reentering shouldn't be a problem unless you unsealed it at the
cockpit and let a lot of get air in behind it while you were still in the
water. Sea socks could come loose or leak so back them up with floatbags,
gear bags or bulkheads.

Disclaimer: I like sea socks and sell them in my store. I also invented the
outrigger paddle-float rescue and promoted its use back in 1981. I sell one
model of inflatable paddle float that I designed so I may be biased here as
well. Around that time I had also invented sponsons for kayaks but they
didn't work out as well and I abandoned the project after some prototypes I
made were tested. [Aside: I would like to see someone do a good job of
making as sponson system that was easier to use, more stable,  and didn't
slow the kayak so drastically as those water plows now available. If someone
wants to work on this I have several ideas and would be more than happy to
share them free of charge. This includes Tim, who unfortunately believes the
present ones are perfect the way they are now and won't listen to any
criticism. Of course if he changed them in any way his patent would no
longer apply because it is so specific to his present ones. BTW Tim's patent
is seriously flawed and just about any sponsons not almost exactly like his
would have no problems not infringing on it (but you might have to weather a
lot of threats and name calling). I made inflatable sponson prototypes long
before he did anyway and have dated slides and the old prototypes still
around to prove it.]

Detailed directions for using a paddlefloat (or paddlefloats) can be found
at our website in the  "Manuals" menu box. A detailed discussion of
flotation systems for sea kayaks and their pros and cons can also be found
in the "Manuals" section as well.

Instead of complaining about the manufacturers not providing you with what
you dream is the perfect solution (a custom fit to each model footpump in
this case) why not look at it as a great small business opportunity and
supply the paddling public with what the manufacturers won't do. Of course
before you spend too much money and time on the project you might want to
research the market and find out why the manufacturers aren't doing it.
Demand at the price they would need to cost is one problem that I can think
of right off. How much would you be willing to pay? Could you make a profit
and recover your investment at that price?

Matt Broze
http://www.marinerkayaks.com

Carter also posits that the re-enter and roll is a necessary skill.  Forget
Paddle floats Carter says.  What about the situation when even with a
perfected re-enter and roll, there is an injury?  Wouldn't you want a paddle
float alternative?

I don't know how ambitious an assignment it is to add the re-entry and roll
to the repertoire.  I think Doug Lloyd posted about this issue some time
ago.

Can someone address experience with the sea sock as a means to reduce "free
surface," or slosh? Is the re-enter and roll hampered by the sea sock?  Can
the sea sock be fastened to the forward bulkhead to facilitate
re-entering?

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