[Paddlewise] E-Trex

I've got a friend who works over at Garmin (they're just a 15-30 minute drive from my office).  I clipped and emailed him all of the posts about the E-Trex looking for a less "corporate" response.  With his permission I'm posting his responses.  The first is before he read any of the specific email when I asked him if he was interested in what was being said.  The second is after I sent him everyones posts: (and these are not formal corporate positions)

--------------------------
I'm not sure what the discussions center around.  The Etrex is rated: 
                         Case: Waterproof to IEC 529 IPX7 standards

The marketing blurb says:
 The eTrex is completely waterproof so it can take an accidental
       splash or dunk in the water and still continue to perform.

Personally I dislike the term "waterproof".  There is really (almost)
nothing that is waterproof (look at the Grand Canyon).  I prefer "water
resistant".  That is what the IPX7 rating is.  It means the unit is designed
to be immersed down to 1 meter for a time of 30 minutes.

<snip name> bought a new watch last year.  It said "Water Resistant 20M" (20
Meters).  We figured, "no problem, the pool is only 10 ft deep at the deep
end".  The watch leaked when he splashed around in the shallow end.  After
the replacement watch also failed the same test, the sales person said that
for immersion, you had to buy one that was WR 30M.  Figure that one out.

As I said before, I don't read paddlewise regularly, so I don't know what
the hashing is about.  Is it about the rating?  The IPX7 is an international
standard that defines the water resistancy.  If the problems are that their
unit failed after getting wet (within IPX7 limits), then they have a valid
reason to return their unit.  

I wouldn't mind hearing what is going on in paddlewise, (may take a look
there), I don't get offended or upset easily, especially if someone is
making a valid point.

-----------------------------
His second response:

Thanks for the information.  I've seen the same kind of conversations in the sat-nav newsgroup.  A lot of what I read below is people's (mis?) interpretation of waterproof and water resistant.  One person wrote "Good grief, they sell something based on a "submersible" standard and they tell you it's only water-resistant?  A submarine is only "water resistant"  Take them down too deep and you'll find out they are not water proof.  The Minolta camera mentioned is not waterproof, but water resistant to 15 ft.  And, yes, the Etrex is designed to be submersible.  One meter.  For 30 minutes.  Unfortunately (IMHO), marketing likes to use the word "Waterproof", when, in fact, the correct term should be "Water Resistant".  As I mentioned in an earlier email, nothing is actually waterPROOF (at least nothing in the context of this discussion).  

The person who quoted the IPX7 spec left out the first part: 

               Protected against the 
               effects of temporary 
               immersion in water 
                                                     Ingress of water in 
     quantities causing 
     harmful effects shall not 
     be possible when the 
     enclosure is 
     continuously immersed 
     in water under 
     standardized conditions 
     of pressure and time 

The standardized conditions of pressure and time are 1M, 30 minutes. 

All that being said, I'd always use a drybag with mine on the water.  If for no other reason than if it falls in, it doesn't float.  Doesn't make much difference if it's water proof/resistant if it's unrecoverable!

Please keep in mind this is my opinion only, I am not speaking for Garmin.
---------------------------

Mel
---
There are three types of people, those who can count and those who can't.


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