[Paddlewise] Instability of folding kayaks (was Re: Rolling a K-lite)

At 07:21 AM 9/12/00 -0700, ralph diaz wrote:
<snip>

>But the issue of rolling a folding kayak is almost academic.  They are
>not prone to tip and even a modicum of a brace will keep you upright in
>absolutely insane waters, or just working like the devil to stay
>centered in your boat will do.

<snip>

>Most folding kayaks have a low brace built into them.  They all can tip
>but they have to go pretty far over to do so.

Ralph, I think there is line between when folding kayaks are more stable or 
less stable than narrow hardshell boats, which I would like to define a 
little better and eliminate confusion.

I am skeptical that folding kayaks are so stable in waters that some people 
on this list would call "absolutely insane". This is definitely a relative 
term, is it not? Never having paddled a folding kayak in rough seas, I 
cannot say for sure, but I have always thought that too much primary 
stability increases the chance of capsize in big steep waves or really 
nasty (by my metric) tide rips.  For example, has anyone paddled a wide 
folding kayak in the tide rip behind the surf wave at Skookumchuck? Now 
that is what I call "insane waters"  -- I have never seen a more confused 
mixture of  2-3 foot high boils with an occasional deep violent whirlpool. 
Even the hardcore whitewater crazies avoid that place, and choose to float 
down a 1/4 mile (in rodeo boats) before trying to cross that eddy fence. 
But if one were to find themselves in an eddy fence of that magnitude, I 
would rather be in a narrow "tippy" boat with great secondary stability 
than in wide "stable" boat with high primary stability. Then I would be 
more able to react with an insta-brace.

In a less extreme example, such as steep wind waves, high primary stability 
tends to make the boat lie flat relative to the local water's surface. But 
if that surface is nearly vertical (as in a steep wave), then a capsize is 
imminent unless the paddler attempts an ill-advised down-wave brace (a 
danger for shoulder dislocations). A low primary, high secondary stability 
boat can just edge into the steep wave ever so slightly, ride over it, and 
have no fear of capsize. Again, since I have never paddled a folding kayak 
in rough water, at what point does the high initial stability become a 
drawback in terms of remaining upright?

Thanks,
Kevin

Kevin Whilden
Your Planet Earth
http://www.yourplanetearth.org
(206) 788-0281 (ph)
(206) 788-0284 (f)

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