Below is forwarded from www.newscoast.com <http://www.newscoast.com/> “Two childhood friends who yearly do an adventure had a fatal kayaking mishap in the Florida Panhandle. Late Thursday night, Mart Dismukes of Sarasota, Fla and Warren Gould of Auburn, Ala., who had been friends since the third grade, finally set off on their second try. This time they used a top-of-the-line two-man seagoing kayak and took along cellular phones, Global Positioning System receivers, a waterproof marine radio and laminated maps to ensure that they didn't fail. But on Christmas Eve, 17 hours after the men had planned to complete their kayak trip, a search team found their bodies. “ For Local reporting see http://www.newscoast.com/2news.cfm?ID=37618 <http://www.newscoast.com/2news.cfm?ID=37618> I don’t know if they had any training or what kind of kayak is “top of the line” – I will forward more as I get it. John Allaman ________________________________________ By The Bay Outfitters 520 Blackburn Point Road Osprey, FL 34229 USA Phone & Fax (941) 966 3937 http://www.kayakflorida.com/ <http://www.kayakflorida.com/> ________________________________________ *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
The article said "Monday, who often sailed with the two men, said Gould and his brother had only started kayaking over the past year." I don't know of many "experienced" kayakers that have developed the necessary skills (such as rolling) and knowledge in that short of time. Although these guys were "geared out"; none were good enough to save their lives. Only the gray matter between ones ears can save lives. sad to hear of this event jim gabriel *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 12/28/00 1:45:49 PM, WaterCrosser_at_aol.com writes: << The article said "Monday, who often sailed with the two men, said Gould and his brother had only started kayaking over the past year." I don't know of many "experienced" kayakers that have developed the necessary skills (such as rolling) and knowledge in that short of time. Although these guys were "geared out"; none were good enough to save their lives. Only the gray matter between ones ears can save lives. >> My thought was that the concerns we have in our small boats just isn't nearly as much of an issue with sailors. It just doesn't occur to them to dress for the water rather than the air. 50º water, a few yards off shore, in shallow water, right where their childhood trip ended with them in the water then, too. I guess we need to add a question to our thinking when we choose to go without maximum protection, can we walk back in? Are we counting on the shallow water to keep us alive? Will the mud keep us from standing up to walk in? Joan Spinner *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
> My thought was that the concerns we have in our small boats just isn't nearly > as much of an issue with sailors. It just doesn't occur to them to dress for > the water rather than the air. 50º water, a few yards off shore, in shallow > water, right where their childhood trip ended with them in the water then, > too. > I guess we need to add a question to our thinking when we choose to go > without maximum protection, can we walk back in? Are we counting on the > shallow water to keep us alive? Will the mud keep us from standing up to walk > in? > > Joan Spinner OK... For safety's sake, I'll open myself up for some trip planning criticism. I've been paddling for about two years and I've owned a Old Town Millennium (17' x 22") for about a year. I paddle about twice a month, I've taken a couple of skills courses, and can self rescue reliably with a paddle float but can't roll. I'm planning a 3 day/2 night, solo trip to the west coast of Florida, USA (Pine Island to Cayo Costa Island) in January. Most of the paddling will be in shallow (1-4'), protected, 60 deg. water. The air temperature will be anywhere between 55 and 80 degrees. I'll be taking along the typical safety gear; pfd, paddle float, pump, whistle, vhf radio, waterproof charts, gps, extra paddle. To tell the truth, I was planning on wearing shorts, polypro long sleeved t-shirt and a paddling jacket. After reading the thread about hypothermia, I think I'll be wearing my farmer john. I consider myself a pretty cautious person (despite my usual preference for paddling alone.) Most of the trip will be spent in the shallows around the numerous mangrove islands, watching the dolphins, manatees and birds. The boat traffic will be light where I'll be paddling except for a couple of brief channel crossings, and around Cabbage Key. This is a dream trip for me, paddling around Cayo Costa in a rented boat was what got me into kayaking in the first place. Am I over looking anything? Steve Posti *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Steve Posti wrote [edited]: > > Am I over looking anything? I always carry a throw bag. Figured I would never need it myself, but might need it to rescue someone else sometime. Well last winter in Florida I paddled up to my destination, a pier about 4' above the water line. I figured I might tip my boat getting out (a 13'8" Old Town Loon 138) so I pulled everything out of my boat and placed it on the pier, including my paddle. I reached up to the pier with my hands and stuck my fingers in some green slime in a cement seam. Yuck! I put my hands in the water and wiggled my fingers to clean off the slime. When I reached back up for the pier, it was out of reach. The current was carrying me out into the river. I tried paddling to shore with my hands. That didn't work. And I was moving farther out. There were warning signs about alligators in that area so I certainly did not want to go in the water. I spied my float bag attached to my seat frame, the only thing I did not take out. I quicky threw the line ashore and snagged it in a piece of splintered wo! od on the pier and pulled myself back in. It also comes in handy as a line to tie your boat up when you go ashore. Bob Matter Hammond, IN ----------- "Savage fires, the worst ever, raged unchecked across drought-ridden US landscapes last summer, West Nile fever broke out in Boston. The ice cap was found full of water and holes, polar bears started to die and persistent floods swept across Britain. Yet on neither side of the Atlantic did green issues register more than a small blip on political screens." --Polly Toynbee, The Guardian *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
At 12/28/2000 11:18 AM -0500, John Allaman wrote: > This time they used a top-of-the-line two-man seagoing >kayak and took along cellular phones, Global Positioning System receivers, a >waterproof marine radio and laminated maps to ensure that they didn't fail. A number of years ago two US Army Rangers in training died from hypothermia in the same general area during a portion of their final exams. The Rangers would leave Georgia and make their way to the Gulf of Mexico. These men. I believe, would be in far better shape and more adapt at surviving extreme weather conditions than the two unfortunate men in this case. Yet, hypothermia can and does take down the best of them. The two men that John let us know about, the two Army Rangers or climbers and many others around the world fall victim to hypothermia. One doesn't often associate Florida with hypothermia, but all it takes is being wet on a 50 degree night and you have the formula for disaster. Rather one is wet from rain, perspiration or a capsize - you are still wet. Without dressing for the water temperature and/or exposure their PFD's didn't do much other than give the search party an easier job of body recovery. In the eyes of the uninformed they were prepared, experience and knowledge says different. What kind of grade do we get when our's and others lifes are at risk from hypothermia, drowning, etc. It doesn't always have to be giant seas and storms to cost a life. Fred T. California Kayak *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
The other factor contributing to hypothermia with Military personel and athletic types is the lack of body fat. You can take a highly tuned, athletic body and a chubby outta shape couch 'tater and put 'em out in the cold. Guess who wins? I did a MTV kayak photo shoot with Gabrielle Reese a couple years back and watched her go from warm and bubbly to cold and shivering in the 5 hours it took to get the footage we needed. She went into denial as I layered her up with my spare poly. Yep, I still got that poly! I, on the other hand was warm as ever. Steve <body fat _at_ 25%>Scherrer aldercreek.com *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On 1/1/01 9:54 AM Fred T, CA Kayaker (cakayak_at_mindspring.com) wrote: >A number of years ago two US Army Rangers in training died from hypothermia >in the same general area during a portion of their final exams. The >Rangers would leave Georgia and make their way to the Gulf of >Mexico. These men. I believe, would be in far better shape and more adapt >at surviving extreme weather conditions than the two unfortunate men in >this case. Yet, hypothermia can and does take down the best of them...... [snip] Actually, I think you'll find that people in "top physical shape" like this are not as well off in terms of succumbing to hypothermia as are people who have plenty of excess body fat to provide both flotation and insulation. Someone just finishing something like Ranger training has probably lost most of their insulating "blubber" and is probably a prime candidate for quicker death from hypothermia. That does not, of course, imply that we shouldn't dress for the water conditions we are paddling in, but being a lean, mean killing machine is not going to help anyone fight hypothermia. Ira Adams Kayaks currently covered by two to three inches of snow in south Mississippi. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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