Hello On an overnight trip this weekend, I ran into a bit of a problem with my boat ( a Necky Narpa) that I haven't had before. On the way back, there was an open crossing where we hit about a 20 knot wind directly from the right hand side. It was combined with a 3 knot current going the same direction, so waves were small. My Narpa weather cocked like mad all the way accross. I soon got fed up leaning and double paddling which wasn't really working, so I used the rudder which helped a lot. Usually this boat tracks very well in wind without any rudder. One of my paddling buds said he thought my boat could have been looking a bit nose heavy. I might have had a little more gear than usual up front ( 10 lbs) but it didn't feel any different in the water. Anyone have any thoughts? Cheers Dan *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Dan, My experience with the Narpa is 20 knots from abeam with even a perfectly balanced load and you'd be using your rudder for exactly what it was designed for. Helping maintain balance. It is NOT a sin! Most boats weathercock _at_ 20k. If they don't then they are very stiff trackers and *probably* hard to turn, unless edged. They also could LEE cock as the wind speeds increase. Lee cocking is the desire for the boat to head downwind, or cock to leeward. Very Scary. =:-o) It's all about BALANCE. Necky's especially are geared to a more maneuverable/ rudder dependent in a blow philosophy. They remove some of the tracking aspect and reduce wetted surface (for speed and maneuvering) then add a rudder. Rudders and retractable skegs help balance the boat to the conditions. Use 'em if you need 'em!!! steve *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
From: "D. Scanlan" <dscanlan_at_shaw.ca> > On the way back, there was an open crossing where we hit about a 20 knot > wind directly from the right hand side. It was combined with a 3 knot > current going the same direction, so waves were small. My Narpa weather > cocked like mad all the way accross. Under those kinds of conditions, I usually let it weathercock some and take advantage of the wind and current to ferry the kayak. That way you prevent crabbing to some extent. You don't always want to point in the direction you're going. The last time I had a significant wind on my beam I played with the skeg until I had just a hint of deployment. That and paddling on one side at a low tempo let me move in the direction I wanted with minimum effort. My speed in the direction of my destination was somewhat slower than the others in my group, but I caught them once we rounded an island and made for the final destination with a tailwind. Using the weathercocking in this way makes me wonder why so many folks complain about it so much. I honestly don't think I'd want a kayak with no weathercocking; I find it works for me almost as much as against. Mike *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Sounds like good advice to me, but I am fairly new to the sport and I am not familiar with the term "deployment". Did you mean until your skeg was sufficiently extended to hold your bow off of the wind by a certain amount? Cheers. Dan > The last time I had a significant wind on my beam I played with the > skeg until I had just a hint of deployment. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
From: "D. Scanlan" <dscanlan_at_shaw.ca> > Sounds like good advice to me, but I am fairly new to the sport and I am not > familiar with the term "deployment". Did you mean until your skeg was > sufficiently extended to hold your bow off of the wind by a certain amount? Basically. I didn't want to cancel out the weathercocking too much, so I just set the skeg down a bit. That made it easier to hold a fixed angle to the wind with a paddle stroke on one side. With more skeg in the water, there was too much correction and I had to paddle on both sides with irregular strokes (either more frequently on one side than the other or with a sweep on one side and a straight stroke on the other). That would have resulted in faster speed, but my arms were tired so I preferred one side only. Mike *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
"D. Scanlan" <dscanlan_at_shaw.ca> wrote: >> On an overnight trip this weekend, I ran into a bit of a problem with my boat [snip] My Narpa weather cocked like mad all the way accross. [snip] Usually this boat tracks very well in wind without any rudder. One of my paddling buds said he thought my boat could have been looking a bit nose heavy. I might have had a little more gear than usual up front ( 10 lbs) but it didn't feel any different in the water. >> Others have dealt with skegs, rudders, etc., but I have not seen anyone address the issue of trim. In short: yes! You can alter the weathercocking/leecocking behavior by loading the boat bow heavy or stern heavy. You probably would not notice this until you got into the heavy seas and wind, and moving 10 lbs from the forward part of the bow compartment to the rear end of the stern compartment should be noticeable in heavy conditions. This is __not__ a good way to deal with weathercocking/lee cocking, though, because once trimmed, you are married to that trim until the end of a rough crossing. I once shepherded a paddler across a windy passage whose boat leecocked slightly, and because the paddler did not have the strength/skills to compensate, we had to tow the person (the boat had no rudder), and if we hadn't, the paddler would have ended up in a bad place. -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 12/3/2002 2:15:36 PM Eastern Standard Time, kdruger_at_pacifier.com writes: > ... Others have dealt with skegs, rudders, etc., but I have not seen anyone > address the issue of trim. > > In short: yes! You can alter the weathercocking/leecocking behavior by > loading the boat bow heavy or stern heavy. ... > > This is __not__ a good way to deal with weathercocking/lee cocking, though, > because once trimmed, you are married to that trim until the end of a rough > crossing. ... Well, yes and no. I paddle a Triton Ladoga-I (folder, just one of the fleet :-). This boat has a strongly upswept bow, excellent in rough conditions, and a low aft deck, allowing breakers overtaking me from behind to wash over the boat rather than just trying to shunt the stern aside into a broach. The hull's center of buoyancy is relatively far aft, dictating that the paddling position in general is fairly far aft also. In conjunction with the described geometry, this leaves the hull quite prone to lee-cocking. "Luckily" the Russian manufacturer supplies only very rudimentary amenities in the cockpit, consisting of an excellent adjustable backband and a somewhat hard, flat piece of plywood on which to sit (you should have heard me swearing the first time I saw it!). The factory rudder set-up leaves a lot to be desired and I tend to distrust these appendages anyway and therefore prefer not to use them. However, it is easy enough to rig an easily adjustable horizontal bar as a foot rest instead. Between the infinite adjustabilty of that backband and footbar and the flat seat, I can quickly and securely shift my paddling position forward or aft sufficiently to trim the boat to counter the "weather vaning" almost entirely -- or to adapt to quite a variety of conditions, to different constellations of wind, waves and current. By the way, since the L-I has what amounts to a split deck stringer, which runs past the paddler's hips (fits my hips with no additional padding), there is plenty of purchase for the thighs and knees in any paddling position also. It seems to me that in our efforts to find (mass produced) boats to fit us and to outfit cockpits so that we can wear them like a glove, we might be overlooking simpler and possibly more practical solutions at times. It would certainly seem that the static approach to most cockpit outfitting can rob us of the flexibility to adapt to changing situations. Has anyone else out there experimented with flexible cockpit outfitting? Best regards, Ralph Ralph C. Hoehn Ralph_at_Atlatl-Kayaks.com / Ralph_at_PouchBoats.com www.Atlatl-Kayaks.com / www.PouchBoats.com phone: +1-203-324-0901 *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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