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From: John Winters <jdwinters_at_eastlink.ca>
subject: [Paddlewise] Paddles
Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2004 08:27:21 -0300
Did I read Peter Chopelas correctly that the ratio of thrust to paddle area 
was unimportant or, at least the wrong issue?

If so I wonder about some things.

Suppose we had two paddles one 120 sq. inches and one 80 square inches. both 
produce the same thrust at the same velocity and the same power input. Does 
this mean that both paddles are equally efficient or that the difference is 
unimportant?

Can anyone think of any reasons why a smaller paddle that produces as much 
thrust as a larger paddle might prove advantageous?

Also what is one to make of C.A. Marchaj's use of the Driving Force 
Coefficient ( Equivalent to the Thrust Coefficient or thrust per unit area)? 
I get the impression from his book 'Sailing Theory and Practice" (See pages 
148 to 154) that this has a significant importance where one wants to 
optimize output from a given input.

Cheers

John Winters
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From: Dave Kruger <kdruger_at_pacifier.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Paddles
Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2004 06:08:37 -0700
John,

First, how about we settle on a physical definition of the term "thrust"?
Is it in foot-pounds (e.g., newton-meters), pounds (newtons), or what?  I
suspect Peter may be using thrust to mean something different from what I
understand it to be:  a force, which would have to be in pounds or newtons.

Secondly, if there were two paddles of differing area, producing the same
thrust (force), then the pressure on the surface of the smaller one would
have to be greater. That would imply less slippage of water off the surface
as the paddle moves though the water (if the paddle is fully stalled).

If the paddle is not fully stalled (or nearly so), then it must be producing
a force through the infamous "lift," using some variant of Bernoulli's
principle.

As for Marchaj's use of thrust per unit area, if thrust is truly a force,
and the area is sail area (don't have the reference at hand), then basically
that means the craft is making more (or better) use of the wind than another
craft of similar sail area.  In other words, one sail could be a highly
refined one and the other could be one that is not.

The parallel to a paddle would be a one that provides more rearward thrust
for the same "effort" (e.g., force put in) by the paddler.  And, this could
be achieved by the infamous "lift."

--
Dave Kruger
Astoria, OR

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Winters" <jdwinters_at_eastlink.ca>

> Did I read Peter Chopelas correctly that the ratio of thrust to paddle
area
> was unimportant or, at least the wrong issue?
>
> If so I wonder about some things.
>
> Suppose we had two paddles one 120 sq. inches and one 80 square inches.
both
> produce the same thrust at the same velocity and the same power input.
Does
> this mean that both paddles are equally efficient or that the difference
is
> unimportant?
>
> Can anyone think of any reasons why a smaller paddle that produces as much
> thrust as a larger paddle might prove advantageous?
>
> Also what is one to make of C.A. Marchaj's use of the Driving Force
> Coefficient ( Equivalent to the Thrust Coefficient or thrust per unit
area)?
> I get the impression from his book 'Sailing Theory and Practice" (See
pages
> 148 to 154) that this has a significant importance where one wants to
> optimize output from a given input.
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PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed
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Subscriptions:   PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net
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