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From: Robert MacDonald <RMacDonald_at_udl.com>
subject: [Paddlewise] Greenland Paddles - Seeing the Flow.
Date: Wed, 8 Sep 2004 10:06:38 -0700
Mike wrote:
"One thing I learned in studying and working in hydrodynamics - you 
can't see the flow.  At least not with some specific markers in the 
water (dye etc).  I know a lot of paddlers see surface effects and 
then make assumptions about what's happening, but that's not the same 
thing as seeing what is happening."

I knew someone would point this out.  You can't see the flow, if it is working right, but you can see the vortex, deep in the water, you can see the turbulence created when imperfections on the leading edge trip the flow, you can see the air sucked down the blade if it ventilates, and you can see the immense amount of turbulence when the blade stalls.  No doubt these are gross effects, and we would be better off studying this stuff at the invisible stage, but this whole problem is still at the gross effects stage.  It is good enough to get the hang of how to use the paddle.

Rob.
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From: Michael Daly <mikedaly_at_magma.ca>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Greenland Paddles - Seeing the Flow.
Date: Wed, 08 Sep 2004 14:24:14 -0400
On 8 Sep 2004 at 10:06, Robert MacDonald wrote:

> I knew someone would point this out.  You can't see the flow, if it is
> working right, but you can see the vortex, deep in the water, you can
> see the turbulence created when imperfections on the leading edge trip
> the flow, you can see the air sucked down the blade if it ventilates,
> and you can see the immense amount of turbulence when the blade
> stalls. 

Unfortunately, it forces you to make the further assumption that the 
ventilated blade works the same as an unventilated etc.  Given the 
substantial difference in density between water and air, I'm 
doubtful.

> No doubt these are gross effects, and we would be better off
> studying this stuff at the invisible stage, but this whole problem is
> still at the gross effects stage.

Too true.

>  It is good enough to get the hang
> of how to use the paddle.

Maybe.  However, unless you have a good understanding of 
hydrodynamics, you may not make the correct interpretations.  Don't 
forget that for aerodynamics, most folks expect pointy noses on 
rockets but rocket designers don't often do that.  Expectation leads 
conclusion.

There is even one GP enthusiast who claims to be an expert in 
aero/hydrodynamics who nonetheless had made some of the most specious 
and unsupportable claims about what a GP can do.  Even "religious 
belief" can result in incorrect assumptions among supposed experts.

Mike
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