Could someone either provide, or point me to a source where I can read, a description of the dangers involved in paddling in and around river mouth "bars". (I think that is the correct name.) As a mainly inland water paddler, I have little knowledge of tides and currents, and I'd like to make myself more aware before I go south this winter to paddle some of the coastal waters of the eastern USA. I have recollections of reading messages from some of you describing river entrance bars, but, of course, at the time I wasn't thinking I'd ever be in a situation to need that info. I seem to recall reading a few articles as well, usually describing harrowing near- misses, but I'm not sure *where* I might have read them. I'd appreciate any and all information and/or pointers. -- Darryl (Hoping to paddle and survive...) *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Not quite an answer to the question you asked but I bet you could hook up with a club in the area that you want to paddle. Local knowledge can lead to great things after the paddle too like where to eat and buy gear. Jim et al On Sep 6, 2007, at 3:21 PM, Darryl wrote: > > As a mainly inland water paddler, I have little knowledge of tides > and currents, and I'd like to make myself more aware before I go > south this winter to paddle some of the coastal waters of the eastern > USA. > > > Darryl (Hoping to paddle and survive...) *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I'll try to do a piece on this tonight or tomorrow for Paddlewise. Craig Jungers Royal City, WA On 9/6/07, Darryl <Darryl.Johnson_at_sympatico.ca> wrote: > > Could someone either provide, or point me to a source where I can > read, a description of the dangers involved in paddling in and around > river mouth "bars". (I think that is the correct name.) > > As a mainly inland water paddler, I have little knowledge of tides > and currents, and I'd like to make myself more aware before I go > south this winter to paddle some of the coastal waters of the eastern > USA. > > I have recollections of reading messages from some of you describing > river entrance bars, but, of course, at the time I wasn't thinking > I'd ever be in a situation to need that info. I seem to recall > reading a few articles as well, usually describing harrowing near- > misses, but I'm not sure *where* I might have read them. > > I'd appreciate any and all information and/or pointers. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Craig Jungers wrote: > I'll try to do a piece on this tonight or tomorrow for Paddlewise. I'm glad to hear that. I thought to myself: "Oof! What a gargantuan task. If only some talented wordsmith would take this on! Maybe Craig will ..." And, here you are! -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Darryl: A Google search will reveal a number of sources of information about bar crossings, and boat handling in general. These sources are intended obviously for motorized craft, but we can still learn from them. [Thanks to Steve Holtzman for correctly listing one good source.] Another location which is not technical is http://www.maritime.nsw.gov.au/boathandling.html I'm not an expert on bar crossings in kayaks. However, there should be similarities between kayak surfing, and kayak bar crossings. So the surfing people could have some valuable input. I do know enough that bar crossings are inherently dangerous, and in Oregon there have been numerous accidents while attempting to cross the bar, involving fishing boats and experienced skippers, with concommitant loss of property and human life. In short, I think a successful navigation of a bar involves aspects of both skill and luck. Numerous skillful skippers have eventually been unlucky. I'm sure Dave, Mark, Dewayne, Craig, etc. can offer more practical advice. Brad Crain Quoting Darryl <Darryl.Johnson_at_sympatico.ca>: > Could someone either provide, or point me to a source where I can > read, a description of the dangers involved in paddling in and around > river mouth "bars". (I think that is the correct name.) > > As a mainly inland water paddler, I have little knowledge of tides > and currents, and I'd like to make myself more aware before I go > south this winter to paddle some of the coastal waters of the eastern > USA. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 9/6/2007 12:27:10 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Darryl.Johnson_at_sympatico.ca writes: Could someone either provide, or point me to a source where I can read, a description of the dangers involved in paddling in and around river mouth "bars". (I think that is the correct name.) As a mainly inland water paddler, I have little knowledge of tides and currents, and I'd like to make myself more aware before I go south this winter to paddle some of the coastal waters of the eastern USA. I have recollections of reading messages from some of you describing river entrance bars, but, of course, at the time I wasn't thinking I'd ever be in a situation to need that info. I seem to recall reading a few articles as well, usually describing harrowing near- misses, but I'm not sure *where* I might have read them. I'd appreciate any and all information and/or pointers. -- Darryl (Hoping to paddle and survive...) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Darryl, I've spent some time in river bars and large inlets draining to sea. Your inquiry indicates the level of respect required of these features. I have a few links listed below for you to peruse. Unfortunately there was an article written by a kiwi that I wanted to include, which I cannot find. You will want to find a copy of Willard Bascom's Waves and Beaches. It is worth owning and referring to time and again. What you have is a pool and an outlet or multiple outlets. In rivers there is also the outflowing current to contend with. Current speed changes with the volume of the river. Coastal embayments that drain also produce hazardous currents. Bars will change on the level of the tide. Bar conditions can be extraordinarily dangerous on the ebb with even moderate river flows. If you look at a chart, near the bar the sea floor is shallower than in other areas. This is shoaling. Waves will feel ground and produce hazardous seas in these areas. The shoaling is produced by sedimentation from the river system. With higher outflow from rain, snow melt, etcetera, bars can increase hazards exponentially, so adopt a bigger view of the primers for potential conditions other than just saying, lets go to (_____) and paddle. Shoaling can go far out to sea and follow the coastal currents significantly. I once planned a trip that involved 3 river bars (without man made features) spread evenly throughout the trip. I picked launch day to coincide with an afternoon high tide. The first river bar was actually the middle outlet of 5 navigable outlets. We arrived and waited for 2 and a half hours for the water to rise sufficiently to leave the beach. That time spent on the beach gave us an opportunity to find the paths best used to find our way out. At low water it was whitewater to the horizon, especially to the north. As the water level rose, the breakers were far reduced. Still, it was a minimum of 20-25 minutes to go from the beach to the outside. One thing we learned on that trip was that the area in between outlets or bars is the same as a bar due to shoaling. We made the mistake of camping in between 2 outlets and it was an ugly fight to get back out the next day. But at least the water was warm. The other mistake we learned from was underestimating the effect on sea state even a small river will have. The shoaling produced by small rivers made a big difference in sea state. Stay sharp on your nav and predict what your sea state will look like given the level of tide. One last piece of advice: tune into the NOAA weather broadcasts. Bar reports are usually broadcasted. The following link is my Webshots page with the mouth of the Sirena river in Costa Rica: http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2676124130067748792EtSJAE The following is a tale written by 2 very strong paddlers that came to grief on a river bar: http://www.nspn.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=3177 Internet kayaking river bar primer: http://books.google.com/books?id=reswnmKlqDQC&pg=PA244&lpg=PA244&dq=crossing+t he+river+bar&source=web&ots=rap-dd0mlq&sig=w7KM7en7DIwvEVMfaWuboNGFK2Y More good advice: http://www.waikato.govt.nz/policyandplans/navigation/safety2006/bylaw.34.htm http://www.marinesafety.vic.gov.au/doi/doielect.nsf/2a6bd98dee287482ca25691500 1cff0c/a5d4bc8313d2379bca256db40024cde1/$FILE/CrossingBars2003.pdf The USCG primer for the Columbia river bar: http://www.uscg.mil/d13/units/gruastoria/bar_hazards.htm Cheers, Rob G ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
This archive was generated by hypermail 2.4.0 : Thu Aug 21 2025 - 16:33:46 PDT