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Hi Scott, On Friday, October 26, 2007, at 4:06:15 PM PST, you wrote: > Are Sea Kayaks Seaworthy? My friend Lisa in a sea kayak on the sea: Not necessarily seaworthy Me in a sea kayak on the sea: At least I'm still alive (knock on wood) Sea kayak on the sea with no paddler: It will probably float No matter how we define "seaworthy", I do find it worthwhile to paddle my sea kayak on the sea. Does that count? :-) Definition of "on the sea", for me: Though I harbor no delusions of paddling non-stop from here to Hawaii, I do paddle coastal waters up to a few miles offshore. My sea kayaks have always carried me with security and grace (even if not with complete dignity at all times, due to the "stupid paddler" variable). I suppose that's seaworthy enough for my porpoises. :-) -- Melissa *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Kayaks are worthy of the sea, but no, they are not inherently "seaworthy." Just one opinion... Harvey Golden *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On 10/26/07, Harvey Golden <harveydgolden_at_yahoo.com> wrote: > > Kayaks are worthy of the sea, but no, they are not > inherently "seaworthy." > Just one opinion... > Harvey Golden Since almost all kayaks populated with a paddler are in their most stable position when inverted, I agree with Harvey. However, almost all empty kayaks seem pretty seaworthy. Over and over rescuers find empty kayaks floating just fine. So the kayaks themselves seem pretty seaworthy while a kayak on the ocean with a paddler in it is probably dangerous as all get-out. Melissa alluded to the answer, I think. More than almost any other ocean-going vessel, the seaworthiness of a kayak depends on the skills and judgement of the operator. And that's worth remembering. Craig Jungers Moses Lake, WA *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Craig Jungers wrote: > Melissa alluded to the answer, I think. More than almost any other > ocean-going vessel, the seaworthiness of a kayak depends on the skills > and judgment of the operator. And the stamina. When we wear out, we are toast, in rough conditions, perhaps not so much if equipped with one of the various stability-enhancement devices (aka sp*ns*ns). There is widespread, deep ignorance among non-paddlers about the virtues of a kayak, however. My power boating buddies always harass me about "that tippy little boat," but when things get really gnarly on the Columbia, I can make way with a greater reserve of safety than they can in their square-transomed, power-trim-tab-stabilized, over-powered, over-loaded gasoline hogs. And then there's surf: try to deal with a 15-20 ft power boat in three-four feet of water in the impact zone. They just do not side-surf well! -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I don't know what happened to the text in my last e-mail, but let's try this again. Are these people related to Timmy? :-) http://www.wavewalk.com/KAYAK%20SEAWORTHINESS.html Scott So.Cal. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi Scott, On Saturday, October 27, 2007, at 11:44:21 AM PST, you wrote: > Are these people related to Timmy? :-) > http://www.wavewalk.com/KAYAK%20SEAWORTHINESS.html I hope John Winters will chime in here and let us know how he feels about being used as he was for "making the case" in this Timmyesque sales pitch. In any event, I'm sure Uncle Timmy would be proud! :-) -- Melissa *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Melissa Reese wrote: [Re: http://www.wavewalk.com/KAYAK%20SEAWORTHINESS.html ] > I hope John Winters will chime in here and let us know how he feels > about being used as he was for "making the case" in this Timmyesque > sales pitch. My exact reaction, also. The odour of scam permeated. The pitch focuses on the extraordinary initial stability of the WWalker, and not at all on the fact that it would be more stable inverted, with the rider/paddler also inverted. And, in surf? Forget it. -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I am most stable with a paddlefloat around my feet and a dozen horseshoes around my neck. Jim et al > > The pitch focuses on the extraordinary initial stability of the > WWalker, and not at all on the fact that it would be more stable > inverted, with the rider/paddler also inverted. And, in surf? > Forget it. > > -- > Dave Kruger > Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi Jim, On Saturday, October 27, 2007, at 3:55:12 PM PST, you wrote: > I am most stable with a paddlefloat around my feet and a dozen > horseshoes around my neck. Sea Anchor is a noble vocation. I just hope that your boat is tethered to the paddle float, as it would be a shame to waste such a dedicated quest for stability! :-) -- Melissa *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On Sat, 27 Oct 2007 11:44:21 -0700, "Scott Hilliard" <kiayker_at_sbcglobal.net> said: > Are these people related to Timmy? :-) > > http://www.wavewalk.com/KAYAK%20SEAWORTHINESS.html For what I see as the target market, fishing and placid stream exploration, I think the wavewalk boat is a better design than most of big open cockpit recreational boats. The boat does have 6 rod holder mounting locations for the avid fisherman.... The 274 cm paddle would take some getting used to. There might be just a little hyperbole in some of their promotion... Rescuing the boat when it goes over could be a real challenge, either as a self or assisted rescue. For the waves that I was playing in yesterday I expect it would have been quickly inverted. I understand in the sailing community the multihull designers/owners are looked at as a bit of a crazy offshoot of sailing. I think the waterwalker is out in the same fringe. Locally we have a sailing multihull designer who is now building sea kayaks. He's brought some of his out of the box thought to his boats http://www.warrenlightcraft.com/ Rumor has it he's also working on a multihull "kayak", possibly a trimaran. Kirk -- Kirk Olsen *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi Kirk, On Sunday, October 28, 2007, at 5:59:48 AM PST, you wrote: > For what I see as the target market, fishing and placid stream > exploration, I think the wavewalk boat is a better design than most > of big open cockpit recreational boats. The boat does have 6 rod > holder mounting locations for the avid fisherman.... The 274 cm > paddle would take some getting used to. There might be just a little > hyperbole in some of their promotion... In about an hour, I'll be launching my death-trap sea kayak into the sea, so if I'm never heard from again, I hope someone will find my boat and enjoy it; at least until they too fall victim to its ultimate lack of seaworthiness, thusly passing it along to the next unlucky soon to be dead paddler. That said... Though I may have several nitpicky things to say about the sales pitch masquerading as a "serious article about sea kayak seaworthiness"--or lack thereof--it's not worth the bother. In any case, I do still see it as a clumsy attempt at an "apples vs. oranges" issue, with a rather substantial bit of hyperbole thrown in for all the wrong reasons. The Dubya-Walker may indeed have its place on the water (mild water, at least), and there may well be many people who can, and will paddle it with safety and joy, so why not concentrate their efforts towards pointing this out rather than trying to "compete" with something that only shares in common its tendency to float? At the very least, in my eyes, it was an idiotic marketing strategy that can only do more harm than good with regards to serious discussions about safety on the water. Enough ranting from me...now I get to go paddling! See you later! (assuming that I survive my foolishness, that is). :-) -- Melissa *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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