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From: skimmer <skimmer_at_enter.net>
subject: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 19:41:46 4
Another paddler that believes he won't capsize, doesn't need to 
prepare for such an event, doesn't know anything about self-rescue 
or cold water--a day dream believer! Get a boat--buy the dream!

I went to a regional USCG and Boating Law Adm. meeting a few 
days back. It is increasingly clear that people buying boats today 
are told how stable they are-- but not that capsizing is a 
fundamental part of both kayaking AND canoeing on flat water or 
rapids!

What kind of boat was this?

Thanks,
Chuck Sutherland

-----------------------------------

Salem-News.com (Apr-13-2008 18:51)
Kayaker Rescued by Coast Guard at Cape Arago
The man was reportedly suffering from hypothermia. 
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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 18:20:59 -0700
On Mon, Apr 14, 2008 at 7:41 PM, skimmer <skimmer_at_enter.net> wrote:

> Another paddler that believes he won't capsize, doesn't need to
> prepare for such an event, doesn't know anything about self-rescue
> or cold water--a day dream believer! Get a boat--buy the dream!
>

Here is the full link to the story:
http://www.salem-news.com/articles/april132008/usch_kayak-4-13-08.php

I don't think it's just paddlers who share this pollyanna-ish view of the
world. I believe it's most people and especially young men under 30. Whether
it's a new phenomenon or just a growth in outdoor activity isn't clear. I
have a friend who lives along a road that I loved to ride on my motorcycle
when I was 28. His daughter, a nurse, refers to "organ-donor Sunday" when,
on a nice day, hordes of sportbike riders from the Seattle area ride at
breakneck speeds along this twisty road. I had ridden fast along that road
but on a 250cc Yamaha not the 100hp machines they use today. And there was
no traffic on that road back then; now it's packed with cars, bicyclists
towing carts with kids, and hikers. Especially last weekend. As a culture,
we have simply lost the ability to discern danger. Television and movies
have convinced many of us that even the most incredibly stupid tricks are
survivable and if anyone says differently then... well, they're just out of
touch.

It's the theme-park attitude; nothing can happen and, if it does, someone
will rescue them. And the article bears it out. Someone did rescue him and
thereby perpetuated the myth that they can't get hurt.

I waited in the safe shoals of my grass island yesterday while a bozo in a
speedboat with a wakeboard tower drove around and around in circles in front
of the launch ramp at full speed. When he tired of it and zoomed off to
another part of the lake I crossed. But not without keeping my eyes peeled
for him - or someone like him.

As they like to say now, "It's all good".


Craig Jungers
Moses Lake, WA
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From: Paul Montgomery <paul_at_paddleandoar.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 20:44:24 -0700
On Apr 14, 2008, at 6:20 PM, Craig Jungers wrote:

> I waited in the safe shoals of my grass island yesterday while a  
> bozo in a
> speedboat with a wakeboard tower drove around and around in circles  
> in front
> of the launch ramp at full speed. When he tired of it and zoomed  
> off to
> another part of the lake I crossed.

Saturday was one of the few nice weather days we've had in a while  
here in Seattle. A guy came into work raving about how I really  
should be out paddling. My reply was that I really don't care for  
those warm sunny days anymore and that I preferred the cool rainy and  
windy days. He was absolutely speechless for a second, wondering if I  
was serious or not.

I explained that, for one, no drunken power boaters. Besides, kayaks  
were made for cold weather and add in a good drysuit and I'm comfy!   
I have come to like windy days. It seems like I get a lot more oxygen  
in my lungs and the wind drowns out the traffic noise on Lake  
Washington.

In fact, I'm hoping for more bad weather. It may drive some of these  
squatters back to California or Arizona land. Get rid of the weak  
ones. And that means less traffic and more room for the rest of us.

It's just a win-wind deal.

Paul Montgomery
paul_at_paddleandoar.com
http://paddleandoar.com
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From: Dave Kruger <kdruger_at_pacifier.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:02:01 -0700
Paul Montgomery wrote:

> I explained that, for one, no drunken power boaters. Besides, kayaks  
> were made for cold weather and add in a good drysuit and I'm comfy!   
> I have come to like windy days. It seems like I get a lot more oxygen  
> in my lungs and the wind drowns out the traffic noise on Lake  
> Washington.
> 
> In fact, I'm hoping for more bad weather. It may drive some of these  
> squatters back to California or Arizona land. Get rid of the weak  
> ones. And that means less traffic and more room for the rest of us.

And, it might be well to remember that almost all of us are "squatters" 
postdating the natives who lived here for thousands of years prior to the 
arrival of Europeans ... says Dave, a native Californian who squatted in 
the Northwest in 1966 in his 21st year ... because dirtbikers, other 
surfers, and other pleasure seekers were beginning to overrun __my__ native 
lands and waters in Southern California!

I think it is all a matter of perspective.

-- 
Dave Kruger
Astoria, OR
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From: Mark Sanders <sandmarks_at_ca.rr.com>
subject: RE: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:48:36 -0700
There's nothing like the relief I've felt since I decided
to feel free to squat wherever I want!

-----Original Message-----
... says Dave, a native Californian who squatted in
the Northwest in 1966 in his 21st year ... because dirtbikers, other
surfers, and other pleasure seekers were beginning to overrun __my__ native
lands and waters in Southern California!

I think it is all a matter of perspective.

--
Dave Kruger
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From: Bruce Grubbs <mail_at_brucegrubbs.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 05:42:52 -0700
No, no. NOT Arizona- Here in Flagstaff we keep wishing for more cold, 
snowy winters so they'll all go back to California!

Bruce
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From: Doug Lloyd <douglloyd_at_shaw.ca>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:08:22 -0700
Craig said (snip):
> It's the theme-park attitude; nothing can happen and, if it does, someone
> will rescue them. And the article bears it out. Someone did rescue him and
> thereby perpetuated the myth that they can't get hurt.
>
> I waited in the safe shoals of my grass island yesterday while a bozo in a
> speedboat with a wakeboard tower drove around and around in circles in 
> front
> of the launch ramp at full speed. When he tired of it and zoomed off to
> another part of the lake I crossed. But not without keeping my eyes peeled
> for him - or someone like him.
>
> As they like to say now, "It's all good".

It's all good if you get some skills and show some good judgement. Nothing 
wrong with treating nature as a theme park, but instead of sitting in a 
roller coaster strapped in and guided by rails, the ride is dangerous and 
requisit skills should be obviously honed prior to engagement, just like 
river paddling. So we are back to judgement, and idiots have poor judgement, 
and those who do have good judgement who push the envelope too soon 
hopefully have some backup. This guy didn't have back up it appears. Luck, 
serendipity, and a Good Samaratin saved his cold, sorry butt - not to 
mention the hard-working CG guys n' gals picking up the slack. And calling 
the CG, if he had had communication potential, still would have been a poor 
initial backup strategy.

It's too bad for open coastal waters of Washington and Oregon, say, there 
weren't more learning opportunities where a guy didn't have to pay 300 
greenbacks to take a course with some cult-status instructor for negotiating 
rock gardens, for example. I notice local stores running more short courses 
for open water paddling. Prices will hopefully be more reasonable. That's 
all good. But some of these instructors don't even no trms like piercing . 
Or maybe it's a nonclamenture thing. Like Paul Caffyn said when he came to 
North America in the early 80's, "I can't believe you guys give intermediate 
symposium classes on how to round headlands. Isn't that a basic skill?" 
Basic skills. Let me see, put on your polypro underwear under your quickdry 
shorts, you put two feet in here, slide in, and paddle away over there 
towards that horizon. Hmmm...maybe it's not all good.

A ranting we will go.

Doug L
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From: Gordin Warner <gwarner2_at_shaw.ca>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 09:28:52 -0700
Doug said (snip):

" But some of these instructors don't even no trms like piercing ."

Well, I'm no instructor, I'm not even an expert.  I have an idea that you 
may not be using the term piercing quite the way it has come to be used in 
our modern culture.  I'm pretty sure you are not referring to; the practice 
of poking holes in body parts then plugging said holes with various objects 
such as bits of glass, scrap metal, or shinny sparkly things designed to 
solicit a specific response or to make a statement.

But I could be wrong. Please explain.

As a foot note, does someone have more information about this incident.  I 
read the account in the Salem News, but no where is there any factual 
information that leads me to conclude that this gentleman was worthy of the 
scorn that's being heaped on him. There was no reference to the equipment he 
was carrying or the skill set he had. Did he have a PFD? Did he have 
immersion gear, a spray deck, signal device, flares etc.  Either he was one 
large guy able to suffer the cold water during the time it took for the 
rescue boat to arrive or else he was wearing some sort of protective gear. 
Or maybe he was just lucky? Does anyone know?

Could he have been a skilled paddler that suffered some sort of 
disabilitating accident?  Was he in in a sea kayak, a surf boat, or one of 
those recretional death traps sold at discount stores?

Wouldn't it be great if someone from the kayaking industry took the time to 
teach editors something about kayaking so that when they send reporters out 
to cover these stories they have some basic knowledge and can subsequently 
ask some penitrating questions. If I read one more story such as, " Cindy 
Lou Who was an expert kayaker who had paddled on guided three day trips the 
last three summers."   Ohhh! Nine days - why that just about makes her a 
Phd.

I hope someone has more information on this incident.

Gordin Warner 
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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 11:31:52 -0700
On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 9:28 AM, Gordin Warner <gwarner2_at_shaw.ca> wrote:

 no where is there any factual information that leads me to conclude that
> this gentleman was worthy of the scorn that's being heaped on him.


Point well taken. Jumping to conclusions is an art, not a science. :)

Wouldn't it be great if someone from the kayaking industry took the time to
> teach editors something about kayaking so that when they send reporters out
> to cover these stories they have some basic knowledge and can subsequently
> ask some penitrating questions. If I read one more story such as, " Cindy
> Lou Who was an expert kayaker who had paddled on guided three day trips the
> last three summers."   Ohhh! Nine days - why that just about makes her a
> Phd.


Well.... I don't want to generalize... but....

Then they'll have to teach journalists and editors about soaring, scuba
diving, rock climbing, hang gliding and all the rest of the "out there on
the edge" activities; not just kayaking. I frankly don't believe anyone has
that sort of time.

Oh, I left out mathematics, science in general, the causes of salmon
declines (it's not *just* the dams... I'm pretty sure catching them and
barbecuing them does them some harm).... I could go on... and on.... and on.

Then they could start on the politicians.

I need a nap.


Craig Jungers
Moses Lake, WA
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From: Gary J. MacDonald <garyj_at_rogers.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 18:04:05 -0400
Craig Jungers wrote:
> Oh, I left out mathematics, science in general, the causes of salmon
> declines (it's not *just* the dams... I'm pretty sure catching them and
> barbecuing them does them some harm).... I could go on... and on.... and on.
>
> Then they could start on the politicians.
>
>   
If they got started on the politicians they would never get finished.
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From: Doug Lloyd <douglloyd_at_shaw.ca>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] capsized
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 22:45:08 -0700
>From the Gordster:

> Doug said (snip):
>
> " But some of these instructors don't even no trms like piercing ."
>
> Well, I'm no instructor, I'm not even an expert.  I have an idea that you 
> may not be using the term piercing quite the way it has come to be used in 
> our modern culture.  I'm pretty sure you are not referring to; the 
> practice of poking holes in body parts then plugging said holes with 
> various objects such as bits of glass, scrap metal, or shinny sparkly 
> things designed to solicit a specific response or to make a statement.
>
> But I could be wrong. Please explain.

No, not that kind of piercing, though I did pierce my Nordkapp with a coated 
stainless steel cable swaged into a circle, through the bow for my bow 
painter. And, I have been pierce-threatened while sufing near an errant 
paddler in one of those ridicoulusly pointy S&G kayaks. I just bought a 
Greatland signal laser and was out pircing the darkness tonight, practicing 
my aiming technique and slowing my sweep-time (no, not on the KLM plane 
heading to Japan overhead).

No, the piercing I refer to my perspectivist friend is the technique one 
uses for ensuring one's kayak bow is oriented seaward as one rounds a large 
obstacle in a rock garden thereby giving a better angle of attack should a 
wave crest be forthcoming "out of the blue", shall we say that might 
threaten to side surf you and yak into said obstacle. John Lull probably 
covers it more eloquently in his book. I don't call it anything myself, just 
naturally having learned that my slow turing Nordy ain't gonna give me fast 
enough swing time to avoid a broach sideways into certain doom by climbing 
over the breaker in time. I also use a "piercing angle" whenever I'm overtop 
reefs or shoaling coastline sections where vigilence and the ability to turn 
quickly to enough of a successful angle to get over a creasting wave is 
paramount to good health and healthy hull hygeni. It's proactive paddling 
101. Amongst serious boomers and close-shore work with rogue-like wave 
occurences, it actually is a manouver one ought to know well. I'm sure you 
have been out practicing these things with the boys.

snip

> I hope someone has more information on this incident.
>
> Gordin Warner

Yeah, I was assuming a neophyte. But why not? Chances are it weren't no 
experienced paddler.

BTW, loved your blog mention of the Sprinter. I saw Kirby's "prime mover" 
recently, and was going to mention the sweat ride on paddlewise before you 
did on your blog, but thought it might be not appropriate and now it's all 
over the internet - well, for anyone who reads your nifty blog. :-)

Doug L 
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From: Robert Livingston <bearboat2_at_comcast.net>
subject: [Paddlewise] The Nubrella for Northwest Kayak Camping.
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2008 23:27:23 -0700
Is this what we have all been waiting for to hang around camp on  
those rainy days?


http://reubenmiller.typepad.com/my_weblog/2008/02/nubrella.html
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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] The Nubrella for Northwest Kayak Camping.
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 2008 08:20:10 -0700
On Tue, Apr 15, 2008 at 11:27 PM, Robert Livingston <bearboat2_at_comcast.net>
wrote:

> Is this what we have all been waiting for to hang around camp on those
> rainy days?
>
>
> http://reubenmiller.typepad.com/my_weblog/2008/02/nubrella.html
>

It still doesn't solve the problem of finding a dry spot to sit.


Craig Jungers
Moses Lake, WA
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