> I received an email from Folbot that had a link to their new folding boat > which, according to the video, comes in one backpack and assembles in 12.5 > minutes. Oh, yeah.... And covers 12.5 nm in 12.5 hours. This is a 10 ft boat with 34" beam. Miracles don't happen. With folders, you either have a well performing and/or rugged hull and frame (think Feathercraft), or fast assembling. This all has been discussed many times at www.foldingkayaks.org. My apologies for late response to the message. Have just returned from the "undiscovered land" - Exumas Land and Sea Park on Bahamas, via same undiscovered Nassau, (and quite deservedly so). Exumas and the Park leave better impression than Nassau, though. With FC Kahuna - 15 ft boat (true), 36 lbs weight (real weight 51 lbs with bag, seat, seasock and rudder), allegedly 20-nimutes assembling (average reported time 30 minutes with rudder, takes me usually 30-35 minutes). Hot, sweltering weather, assembe after red-eyes flight from Vancouver (+ 3 hrs time difference), moving slow like a lemur, few mistakes requiring partial dissembling and assembling again. Result: 6 hours (!!!), including packing in all the 2-week food and gear, 30 minuters lunch break, 30 miinutes rain break, few minutes talking to a police cruiser (no, officer, I'm not camping, I'm assembling and getting the heck out of here), and to local yachtie about the closest wilderness campsite. Probably, the assembling itself took some 2 or 2.5 hours. (And I have already assembled it dozens of times before, less than 40 minutes usually). But it is really a seaworthy folder, fast, extremely rudded, and capable of a 2-week unsupported trip with a paddler under 160 lbs (3 weeks if you don't have to carry 20 liters of fresh water). Back to the newly discovered folder. Anybody concerned may visit www.folbot.com for more details. ..."Bag dimensions: 35" x 18" x 10". Only 24 lbs., it packs down small and takes minutes to assemble. ...With this urban friendly boat - just toss it over your shoulder and hop on the subway or bus"... My 2 cents: You may safely add 10 lbs to the above 24 lbs of the stated weight of the boat (bag, seat, sprayskirt, cockpit cover), and another 10 lbs of paddle, pump, PFD, snack, water bottle, sunblock etc - about 44 lbs in total. Like I said, packed FC Kahuna weighs 51 lbs, and it DOES come in a good backpack (same size as this 10-ft Folbot bag), so you don't have to toss it over your shoulder, risking to dislocate some spinal vertebra. Backpack of that size is very bulky and makes for uncomfortable weight distribution, so 50 lbs feels like 70. You can't walk nonchalantly with such a hump, you can hardly toil along some 100-200 yards. With FC, there have been some suggestions from European users on how to use a kayak cart to tranport an FC backpack (they do use trains and buses - we apparently have bypassed this evolutionary step on the West Coast). Some carts are not suitable for trains, and some suitable are too bulky for storing under deck in a single folder, - so this does represent a problem. "Tossing it over your shoulder", they say? What manufacturers think, I wonder, when they attach a gym-bag strap to some 40-50 lbs bag (not just this one - there are some other too). Perhaps, they need somebody to injure oneself and sue these buffoons. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
alex wrote: >> I received an email from Folbot that had a link to their new folding boat >> which, according to the video, comes in one backpack and assembles in 12.5 >> minutes. > > Oh, yeah.... And covers 12.5 nm in 12.5 hours. This is a 10 ft boat with 34" > beam. Miracles don't happen. With folders, you either have a well performing > and/or rugged hull and frame (think Feathercraft), or fast assembling. [snip] I usually let Alex sink in his own juices, but this blast of misinformation exceeds his usual quota. I suspect anyone who has really looked this boat over will see that it is a significant departure from Folbot's usual meter. The Citibot is not intended to be a long-haul, rough water craft. It is a "City Boat," and as such is for those leisurely late afternoon (or early morning) paddles on the local reservoir, placid lake, or backwater. It is not designed to satisfy a globe trotter like Alex, who needs a heavier, stronger setup. A knee jerk response such as the one Alex made is unfair to the manufacturer and does not help folks new to the sport evaluate a new product. It is fair to say that Alex has a prejudice against Folbot products; as far as I know, he has not handled any of the newer models of their boats, yet continually knocks them. That is unfortunate, because Alex has a wealth of experience and is a valuable resource when he discusses boats he knows well. Note: I have no affiliation with Folbot, except that I own three of their boats, and have found them to be safe, useful craft for their intended uses. They have limitations, as does any boat. -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 5:09 PM, alex <al.m_at_3web.net> wrote: > > > Oh, yeah.... And covers 12.5 nm in 12.5 hours. This is a 10 ft boat with > 34" beam. Miracles don't happen. With folders, you either have a well > performing and/or rugged hull and frame (think Feathercraft), or fast > assembling. > I don't think this boat is aimed at expedition (or even weekend) paddlers but, rather, at people with limited storage space and an occasional urge to paddle a local lake, slough, estuary, or calm waterfront. It might not be a Feathercraft but it doesn't cost US$4k either. > "Tossing it over your shoulder", they say? What manufacturers think, I > wonder, when they attach a gym-bag strap to some 40-50 lbs bag (not just > this one - there are some other too). Perhaps, they need somebody to injure > oneself and sue these buffoons. > We all have our prejudices and preferences when it comes to boats, I guess. I'm not sure how you get to 40-50 pounds from an original 24 pound (even if you add your 10 pounds to that it's still only 34 pounds). Even I can carry 34 pounds on my back without risking injury. I still think that this Folbot - and Folbot kayaks in general - have a place in kayaking. Perhaps not the same place as Feathercraft but surely there must be room for competition. Not everyone will be taking their folding or inflatable kayaks to the Bahamas. It would be nice to see a review of this boat from someone who has actually paddled one. Craig Jungers Moses Lake, WA *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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