Hi Joq, Sorry to see another paddling accident/death in conditions benign by any measure. In PA, the State Fish and Boat will not allow out any collected information on any boating accident. It appears that giving the impression that accidents don't happen in PA is more important than educating the public. The same rules apply in RI. The press reports are all we get and the regulatory agencies don't care if they are right or wrong. In my opinion, there is a general failure of regulatory agencies to help the public understand the nature of "ACCIDENTS". They are generally unanticipated and over in an instant. Victims are either prepared or not, but there is no chance for replay. This past week, when our friend capsized his sailing canoe, all his chase boat saw was the bottom of the canoe. The victim was briefly panicked, but popped to the surface on his pfd. After thrashing about for a few seconds, he realized that his pfd was holding him at the surface. He calmed down and they carried out a rescue. This fellow has serious medical issues such that a single gasp of water would certainly kill him. He said afterward that the capsize happened so fast he had no idea what happened. This is how accidents usually happen. Victims are either prepared, or not! The problem is that boaters do not believe accidents can happen to them. The problem is that accidents can't be predicted. How could the victim have known that such an event as (fill in the event) would happen? Chuck Sutherland *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Do people still believe in accidents? Here in Oregon, every time someone drowns, or is shot, or dies, or gets lost, the press labels it an accident. Every traffic collision is an accident according to the news. Every time a trucker wrecks his rig, it's because his load shifted. I think true accidents are as rare as sightings of the tooth fairy. I don't believe in boating accidents or car accidents. Everything has a cause and an effect. Dozens of cyclists in Oregon have been killed "by accident". Boy, were they "unlucky". An accident is when an asteroid falls from the sky and punches a hole in your kayak. > Hi Joq, > > Sorry to see another paddling accident/death in conditions benign by any > measure. In PA, the State Fish and Boat will not allow out any collected > information on any boating accident. It appears that giving the impression > that accidents don't happen in PA is more important than educating the > public. The same rules apply in RI. The press reports are all we get and > the > regulatory agencies don't care if they are right or wrong. > Chuck Sutherland *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
No asteroids in the Potomac this time -- probably. And what is an accident, anyway? Too many definitions out there -- but if we modify whatever "accident" means with the word "preventable", we've got something more meaningful. Stuff happens -- basically the root of "accident". Why stuff happens is the important bit because maybe there's a "teachable moment" in a preventable accident that an "act of God" would not provide. Facts in this case? We may never know: Chuck Sutherland is right. Privacy issues and litigious people keep the information in a case like this to a minimum. Anecdotal information indicates that Mr. Huggins could not swim; it appears that Belle Haven Marina provides PFDs with their kayak rentals -- and good on 'em for that: (we had a well-known local outdoor equipment retailer that rented out kayaks without PFDs a few years ago, but they came to their senses when presented with the facts.) More anecdotal information says that Huggins didn't put a PFD on, and he certainly didn't have it on when they finally located his body on the bottom -- very near the spot where he capsized. So let's see: (1) probably not a regular kayaker. (2) can't swim. (3) wouldn't wear a life vest. Is there a preventable accident trying to happen here? Nope -- Bradford Crain is certainly right. Everybody's a newbie sometime; don't need to be able to swim if you're in a boat; lifejackets are for little kids -- like sitting in the back seat of the car. See, it was just like an asteroid hit him after all. There's just no way to keep Darwin from working. Stuff happens. Sadly. Joq -----Original Message----- From: Bradford R. Crain [mailto:crainb_at_pdx.edu] Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 12:12 PM To: skimmer; Martin, Jack; Paddlewise_at_paddlewise.net Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] accident report Do people still believe in accidents? Here in Oregon, every time someone drowns, or is shot, or dies, or gets lost, the press labels it an accident. Every traffic collision is an accident according to the news. Every time a trucker wrecks his rig, it's because his load shifted. I think true accidents are as rare as sightings of the tooth fairy. I don't believe in boating accidents or car accidents. Everything has a cause and an effect. Dozens of cyclists in Oregon have been killed "by accident". Boy, were they "unlucky". An accident is when an asteroid falls from the sky and punches a hole in your kayak. > Hi Joq, > > Sorry to see another paddling accident/death in conditions benign by > any measure. In PA, the State Fish and Boat will not allow out any > collected information on any boating accident. It appears that giving > the impression that accidents don't happen in PA is more important > than educating the public. The same rules apply in RI. The press > reports are all we get and the regulatory agencies don't care if they > are right or wrong. > Chuck Sutherland *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Yeah, I agree. The word "accident" makes it sound totally random. Maybe one could say in a typical scenario here that the manatee surfacing under the kayak was an accident. The fact that the paddler drowned afterward could have been prevented and was the result of bad judgement, skills or gear. Having the right gear is judgement and knowing how to use it is a skill, so it's all balled up together. Anyway, I think of what is often called an "accident" as failing to beat the odds that particular time. Every time you go out there's a chance - maybe a small one, but something greater than zero - that things will not go as you expect/wish. What is your recourse? Do you have what you need in the skills/gear continuum to come back and rack your boat that night? How much are you willing to bet? That's what it is after all. You know how a lot of people like to read fortune cookies and then add "in bed" after it? When I challenge someone for not wearing the pfd that's on their deck or whatever I add "yet!" to the typical response. "I've been out a lot and never fallen in." "I'm a good swimmer, I won't have a problem." "I don't need a roll. I don't fall over." Safety is no accident. On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 12:12 PM, Bradford R. Crain <crainb_at_pdx.edu> wrote: > Do people still believe in accidents? Here in Oregon, every time someone > drowns, or is shot, or dies, or gets lost, the press labels it an accident. > Every traffic > collision is an accident according to the news. Every time a trucker wrecks > his rig, > it's because his load shifted. I think true accidents are as rare as > sightings of the tooth > fairy. I don't believe in boating accidents or car accidents. Everything > has a cause > and an effect. Dozens of cyclists in Oregon have been killed "by accident". > Boy, were they "unlucky". An accident is when an asteroid falls from the > sky > and punches a hole in your kayak. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
now, now kids... "accident" merely means it was not intentional -- so when someone drowns and it was neither murder nor intentional suicide it was an accident. Accidents always still hold out the notion of someone being at fault. I think the news media folks would admit that someone was at fault though their limited knowledge would probably have the fault being that ANYONE do something as foolish as being on the ocean in such a tiny, tippy boat. On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 12:44 PM, Carey Parks <carey_at_jimparksfamily.com>wrote: > Yeah, I agree. The word "accident" makes it sound totally random. Maybe one > could say in a typical scenario here that the manatee surfacing under the > kayak was an accident. The fact that the paddler drowned afterward could > have been prevented and was the result of bad judgement, skills or gear. > Having the right gear is judgement and knowing how to use it is a skill, so > it's all balled up together. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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