>The advanced boats can do wonderful things in the hands of experienced >paddlers with superb skills. But beginners and intermediate paddlers >are much better off in boats more suited for them. They may never >develop the skills to take advantage of an advanced boat and may have >lots of hairy experiences they could avoid in a more suitable boat. > Can you be specific as to what all those wonderful things are that the advanced boat is capable of? Is performance more than just top speed? >I recall many years ago the experience of two paddlers in horredous >conditions off the New Jersey coast. One, an instructor with impeccable >rolling skills and in an easily leaned, responsive British boat. The >other, a darn good paddler in a plastic Chinook who was too cheap to buy >a glass boat or still working out which one he really wanted. The >instructor got hit with breaking waves in high seas. Rolled up, got >dumped, rolled up, got dumped again, etc. He just could never get >settled enough before being hit in an instant with another dumper. >Finally he wet exited. The guy in the Chinook managed to broach and go >into a brace on one of the waves and rode in with it and subsequent ones >for a half a mile. He never dumped or had to roll (although he was a >good roller but not on the level of the other guy). The guy in the >Chinook took advantage of the initial stability of the boat plus its >moderate lean capacity to get himself out of the predicament. The >advanced paddler in the advanced boat, for all of his skills, couldn't >keep up with the situation. Again, other than top speed, what performance advantage does the Nordkapp have over the Chinook? Assuming this story is true, than the Chinook has more performance in that it allows kayaking in rougher conditions. Can this be true? I never paddled either boat, but I bet that true blue Nordkappers would disagree. Or when the conditions get really hairy are they wishing they were in Chinooks? Jerry *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Gerald Foodman wrote: > > >The advanced boats can do wonderful things in the hands of experienced > >paddlers with superb skills. But beginners and intermediate paddlers > >are much better off in boats more suited for them. They may never > >develop the skills to take advantage of an advanced boat and may have > >lots of hairy experiences they could avoid in a more suitable boat. > > > > Can you be specific as to what all those wonderful things are that the > advanced boat is capable of? Is performance more than just top speed? They can be leaned more effectively when broached (sideways) to a wave and therefore supposedly ride out the wave better. But that is relative since even less advanced boats with more initial stability can generally be leaned sufficiently. The advanced boats also roll easier. They fit snugger or are set up that way. And so you do feel a certain oneness with the boat and it responses to hip flicks and leans very easily. Broader boats won't do that. With an advanced boat, you can do a storm sculling motion where you get the boat totally on its side and have most of your body under the water except part of one arm and your face pointed upward to breath as you do a shallow sculling brace. A narrow responsive boat that fits you to a Tee allows this motion. In a broader boat, it would tip over at that point, the paddle would dive and you would be too loose in it to do this paddle stroke. BUT how many people can do that stroke, or roll with a bombproof roll or hang on to the side of a wave in a low or high brace with their body leaned into it for more than a few seconds? It isn't the boat that does the trick...it's the highly skilled, well practiced paddler. > > >I recall many years ago the experience of two paddlers in horredous > >conditions off the New Jersey coast. One, an instructor with impeccable > >rolling skills and in an easily leaned, responsive British boat. The > >other, a darn good paddler in a plastic Chinook who was too cheap to buy > >a glass boat or still working out which one he really wanted. The > >instructor got hit with breaking waves in high seas. Rolled up, got > >dumped, rolled up, got dumped again, etc. He just could never get > >settled enough before being hit in an instant with another dumper. > >Finally he wet exited. The guy in the Chinook managed to broach and go > >into a brace on one of the waves and rode in with it and subsequent ones > >for a half a mile. He never dumped or had to roll (although he was a > >good roller but not on the level of the other guy). The guy in the > >Chinook took advantage of the initial stability of the boat plus its > >moderate lean capacity to get himself out of the predicament. The > >advanced paddler in the advanced boat, for all of his skills, couldn't > >keep up with the situation. > > Again, other than top speed, what performance advantage does the Nordkapp > have over the Chinook? Assuming this story is true, than the Chinook has > more performance in that it allows kayaking in rougher conditions. Can this > be true? I never paddled either boat, but I bet that true blue Nordkappers > would disagree. Or when the conditions get really hairy are they wishing > they were in Chinooks? The story is true since I heard it just a few days after it happened and talked extensively to all the people involved. I think you missed the point or points of my story. First, the performance boat in the story had a great paddler in it but even at some point, he could not handle the situation because his boat lacked enough initial stability to get set for the next wave. The guy in the Chinook chose to ride out the waves on a broached brace. The boat was good enough to do what he needed and had the sufficient skill for what is a fairly moderate task. What surprised me is his ability to hold it for half a mile or more. I think it was a nice combination of initial and secondary stability that allowed this plus just the modicum lean allowed in the Chinook. Experts will feel happier and challenged in their advanced boats; the rest of us will be happier in boats that do some of the stuff for us and apply our less sharp and less practiced smaller arsenal of skills. ralph -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024 Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com "Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
As a relatively new Nordkapper, my impressions of the boat in rough water compared to more stable boats is that it's less work to remain upright BUT easier to get knocked over, as was the case below. > >The advanced boats can do wonderful things in the hands of experienced > >paddlers with superb skills. But beginners and intermediate paddlers > >are much better off in boats more suited for them. They may never > >develop the skills to take advantage of an advanced boat and may have > >lots of hairy experiences they could avoid in a more suitable boat. > > > > Can you be specific as to what all those wonderful things are that the > advanced boat is capable of? Is performance more than just top speed? > > >I recall many years ago the experience of two paddlers in horredous > >conditions off the New Jersey coast. One, an instructor with impeccable > >rolling skills and in an easily leaned, responsive British boat. The > >other, a darn good paddler in a plastic Chinook who was too cheap to buy > >a glass boat or still working out which one he really wanted. The > >instructor got hit with breaking waves in high seas. Rolled up, got > >dumped, rolled up, got dumped again, etc. He just could never get > >settled enough before being hit in an instant with another dumper. > >Finally he wet exited. The guy in the Chinook managed to broach and go > >into a brace on one of the waves and rode in with it and subsequent ones > >for a half a mile. He never dumped or had to roll (although he was a > >good roller but not on the level of the other guy). The guy in the > >Chinook took advantage of the initial stability of the boat plus its > >moderate lean capacity to get himself out of the predicament. The > >advanced paddler in the advanced boat, for all of his skills, couldn't > >keep up with the situation. > > Again, other than top speed, what performance advantage does the Nordkapp > have over the Chinook? Assuming this story is true, than the Chinook has > more performance in that it allows kayaking in rougher conditions. Can this > be true? I never paddled either boat, but I bet that true blue Nordkappers > would disagree. Or when the conditions get really hairy are they wishing > they were in Chinooks? > > Jerry > > *************************************************************************** > PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List > Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net > Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net > Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ > *************************************************************************** > > Bob Denton Vice President Undersea Breathing Systems bob_at_dnax.com www.dnax.com *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
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