Several people had asked me to post on PaddleWise what VHF radio I finally picked. After comparing a lot of things, I went with the Apelco 520. Here is my reasoning: The ICOM M-1 had been my first choice for size, etc. But I wavered on it because of the lack of real submersibility as admitted by the tech support people (see earlier post). It bugs me that they claimed a submersibility rating on the Web but it just ain't so according to their tech staff, albeit you get a full warranty for water damage. Also the M-1 is limited in battery power to around 4 hours unless you get the M-1 Plus with a bigger NICAD pack that is rated at 10 hours but which then makes it slightly bigger and heavier. Again, neither is truly waterproof in submersion. And no alkaline battery option. Lowest prices I found were $215 and $230 respectively for the M-1 and M-1 Plus; $229 and $249 were more typical prices for these units. The Apelco 520 seemed to me to be a better item. It offers a NICAD power pack rated at about half way between the two versions of the ICOM M-1, i.e. around 7 hours. But it does have an alkaline battery pack as well as the NICAD. A call to Apelco tech support (really Raytheon, which owns Apelco) reveals a couple of things regarding submersibility. The radio is that JIS-7 submersible rated (30 minutes at 1 meter depth) when using the NICAD pack which snugs in well into the radio. The alkaline battery configuration is not JIS-7 rated because of how the pack fits in. If submersed with the alkaline pack, the radio would not be damaged but the alkaline pack would; you would then have to replace the alkaline pack for around $25. Not a bad setup overall with lots of flexibility of use because of the two battery type option. Price listed was around $260 but I did much better. It was listed in local stores at $229 (E&B Marine, I think a West Marine sub) but not available at the store in Manhattan; calling around to the suburbs yielded just one on Long Island, a floor model. Defender Marine had it on their web site at that $264 figure. I called to take them up on their standing offer to match a legit lower price and was ready to argue the local $229 competitive price in my best city smarts way. But when I asked what their price was they said $205!!!! So, I did well without having to be a pushy New Yorker. Relative weight of the units: ICOM M-1 (10 oz); ICOM M-1 Plus (13 oz). The Apelco 520 is listed at 17 oz. but on a scale it is only 11 oz!!. The Apelco seems to be about a quarter of an inch or so bigger than the ICOM M-1 in height, width, depth. The ICOM M-1 Plus appears to be about 3/4 to an inch longer than both. I was looking for something small...so such things do concern me. Afterwards, I decided to look again at all the past postings of the last few weeks regarding VHFs. There had been so much talk, some real technical, that it had flown by me pretty much. Well lo and behold, my email pal Jack Martin had recommended that specific model! He seems savvy regarding radios and lots of other things; or he certainly talks a good game :-). So I'm glad I came to the same conclusion from a less hands on knowledge but comparison shopping level. Also BlueCanoe, aka John Le Blanc, said he has had excellent results with his three Apelco radios (two fixed and one HH). I saw another extremely good radio, BTW. The Standard 350. It is also truly submersible by reputation in addition to claim and has more capacity, 12 hours. This radio's display window is the biggest I saw which is good. This radio is heavy, over a pound--perhaps 1.25 lb. It has a alkaline pack in addition to the Nicad and comes with even a 12 volt charger setup in addition to the AC kind. It cost however $279 at E&B Marine. It is ever so slightly bigger than the Apelco but looks more ruggedly built. I did not call their tech support people but something tells me that in the alkaline pack configuration it might also fare well in submersion. Just a hunch. Price and size made my choice of the Apelco 520 the right one for me. I think that there is a bigger NICAD battery pack for mine as well...I saw a mention of it on some web site. But I think what I got will work just fine and more battery power means more weight...an almost inescapable point of physics. Oh, I've decided not to use a waterproof plastic bag with it. I don't see that well, nor do I hear well either. The bag cuts down too much in both senses departments. I don't roll and have been in the water accidentally only once in 10 years; so my chances of actually submerging are slim. I will take my chances with the radio sans bag especially since someone here reported that in his experience all bags leak some. If I find the radio sans plastic bag fails because of water damage, I will return the thing under the 3 year warranty and thereafter use a protective bag. I will have to tether the radio in some way, however, so I don't lose it overboard. I could attach a float possibly. We shall see. Thanks for all the advice, ralph diaz -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024 Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com "Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
I have had a Standard 350 for over a year and use it on the deck without a bag.. I like the radio and the ability to take nicads or alkalines. cya *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Bob Denton wrote: >I have had a Standard 350 for over a year and use it on the deck without a >bag.. I like the radio and the ability to take nicads or alkalines. I've got an apelco 520, and even though it's reputedly submersible, I use it in a bag... (after flooding an Icom). Anyone use the 520 out of the bag? Robert *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Rob Nevitt wrote: > > rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com wrote: > > > > Several people had asked me to post on PaddleWise what VHF radio I > > finally picked. After comparing a lot of things, I went with the > Apelco 520. > > I was the one who originally posted the message: "VHF questions: power > output, power source, & weather resistance?" At the time I was looking > at the Icom M3A and a Uniden unit. I ended up getting the Apelco 520 > also as it had all 3 things I was looking for: 5 watts (actually 1/3/5), > alkaline backup, and submersible. I didn't get quite as good a price -- > $225 from Consumer Marine Electronics -- but I'm satisfied. I think that Rob and I should hasten to state the standard disclaimer that we have no connection to Apelco or its parent Raytheon!!! :-) Your $225 is lower than any other I had seen. I just lucked into that low price I found. All New Yorkers have a bit of Woody Allen in them from the character he played in one of his movies who said "The biggest sin in my family was buying (at) retail." :-) Like anything, the prices may have lowered for some such thing as a newer, better model coming out. Such is life. > > I had one problem with the unit; it seems that the screws on the > alkaline packs sent with some units are a few threads too long and the > battery pack doesn't make good contact with the terminals. I called > tech support and they are sending me a new one. I haven't tried the alkaline pack yet. But in researching all over the place with various manufacturers, I have seen this as an occasional complaint with battery packs, i.e. they don't make as rich a contact with the radio's terminal pad as they should. I have to give mine a try. It happens with anything made of parts. Boy, could I tell stories about folding kayaks, but the manufacturers are paying me off to keep mum. :-) > > They also explained to me that the alkaline pack should really be used > as backup to the nicads as it will only provide a couple of hours of > use. Thanks for the info on submersability. Some else had indicated that in some of the radios with switchable alkaline and NICAD arrangements that sometimes the alkaline configuration doesn't have as much punch. Unlike most of the other alkaline arrangements, the Apelco 520's one has just 5 AAs rather than the usual 6 AAs; so that is definitely less. I did wander back over various web sites and found the reference to a larger NICAD pack for this radio, 1200 rather than the 650 standard; it will run a theoritical 12 hours full power as opposed to about 7. This bigger pack is the standard pack from the Raytheon 106 radio which also has 6 watt power and is submersible making it supposedly the most powerful, longest lasting of the handhelds. The bigger pack will fit the Apelco 520 but it makes the overall package slightly taller. ralph diaz -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024 Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com "Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 1/18/99 1:18:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, rcline_at_onramp.net writes: << I've got an apelco 520, and even though it's reputedly submersible, I use it in a bag... (after flooding an Icom). Anyone use the 520 out of the bag? >> I've been using its predecessor, the 510, de-bagged for five years. Never a problem with water, even when doing rolls and braces (not deliberately with the VHF on the PFD --- just forgot). Did give it a good smack once on a concrete abutment and cracked the display window, letting in water. Apelco replaced it, even with some obvious mishandling. My guess is that you'll be fine with the 520, using JIS-7 standards, considering what I've gotten away with on the 510. Jack Martin *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
I too have an Apelco 520. Though I haven't had it but a month, and on the water only about 3 times, I've yet to use a protective bag/pouch. It has gotten wet, but not submerged. Only problem I've had is the low end operating temperature of -20 C (~0 F) seems to be accurate. Warm it up and it works fine. Go out with it in my PFD pocket at 0 F and it does not work. Looking at making a harness or pouch to wear inside, between PFD and drysuit. John Browning Milwaukee, Wisconsin *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
WildConect_at_aol.com wrote: > > I too have an Apelco 520. Though I haven't had it but a month, and on the > water only about 3 times, I've yet to use a protective bag/pouch. It has > gotten wet, but not submerged. Only problem I've had is the low end operating > temperature of -20 C (~0 F) seems to be accurate. Warm it up and it works > fine. Go out with it in my PFD pocket at 0 F and it does not work. Looking > at making a harness or pouch to wear inside, between PFD and drysuit. A couple of thoughts: 1. Rather than any elaborate harness or pouch for the inside of your PFD, just tether it with its existing strap (or something longer) to a D-ring on the outside of your PFD. Then just lay it inside the PFD against you. This way it would be safe to access and let go if you need to do something else with your hands and it will not go overboard. Same if your forget when unzipping your PFD later...tethered it will not fall to the ground. 2. Get one of those soft covers that Apelco sells. I have not seen it but I think it may be made of neoprene. There are universal flotation covers for VCRs sold by West Marine among others. I don't know if the Apelco soft cover option is the same. If it is, then having may help in insulating the radio a bit in cold weather while keeping the radio in an outside pocket. It would, of course, first have to come from warmer ambience before putting it inside the cover; and don't expect the radio to stay absolutely warm. I intend to check out the Apelco cover as a just-in-case flotation cum cushioning handy device. 3. Before Bob Denton volunteers this...GO SOUTH, YOUNG MAN! Everything is better in Florida...even VHF radio!!! :-) ralph diaz -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Ralph Diaz . . . Folding Kayaker newsletter PO Box 0754, New York, NY 10024 Tel: 212-724-5069; E-mail: rdiaz_at_ix.netcom.com "Where's your sea kayak?"----"It's in the bag." ----------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
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