What type of charger is used for Gel cell and would a solar charger work if it was mounted on rear deck? Larry C. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
> What type of charger is used for Gel cell and would a solar charger work > if it was mounted on rear deck? > > Larry C. An important question Larry because when I bought my gel cell battery the guy told me I needed a special charger for it. He showed me a couple of chargers that had a "gel cell" setting so I think he was being up front about it. My charger is a Minn Kota charger that I use for my big marine trolling motor battery (for my canoe). I haven't had any problems using it. The gel cell charges in just 1-2 hours on the charger and the charger cuts off when the battery is fully charged. I don't know enough about the solar chargers to answer that part of your question. My earlier post got me thinking about how long the battery would last running the bilge pump, so right now it is sitting in a sink full of water pumping water up a 2' hose. It's been running for over an hour now (~450 gallons or 60 cubic feet of water) and still running without any noticable weakening. That should pump out the boat a few times 8^) Also the battery I mentioned earlier (YT4L-BS) is a 3AH battery and measures 4.38"L x 2.5"W x 3.81"H and weighs 2.9 lbs. There are 6AH batteries only slightly larger and about 2 lbs heavier. Woody *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Robert Woodard wrote: > > My earlier post got me thinking about how long the battery would last > running the bilge pump, so right now it is sitting in a sink full of water > pumping water up a 2' hose. It's been running for over an hour now (~450 > gallons or 60 cubic feet of water) and still running without any noticable > weakening. That should pump out the boat a few times 8^) I guess that also answers the question I wanted to ask you about how much water the pump moves. > 400 gph? I guess my cockpit is ~ 30 gal, so it could empty it in 4-5 minutes, right? Of course, it would only be about 1/2 full, and I displace a little (OK, maybe more than a little) myself. Does this calculation make sense? Steve -- Test Scoring & Reporting Services Sometimes, you never can University of Georgia always tell what you Athens, GA 30602-5593 least expect the most. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Steve wrote: > I guess that also answers the question I wanted to ask you about how > much water the pump moves. > 400 gph? I guess my cockpit is ~ 30 gal, so > it could empty it in 4-5 minutes, right? Of course, it would only be > about 1/2 full, and I displace a little (OK, maybe more than a little) > myself. Does this calculation make sense? > > Steve Mine is empty in about 3-4 minutes I think. Never timed it. If not for it sitting on top of my truck for my trip out in the morning, I'd fill it up and time it. I found the posts on charging batteries very informative. I thought I had a gel cell battery but now I think it could be a glass mat battery. It looked like a sand that turned to gel when I added the acid though. The reason I'm having second thoughts on its construction is the charging instructions on the top of the battery: STD: 0.4A X 5~10h or QUICK: 4.0A X 30 min. I wouldn't expect a gel cell to be capable of a quick charge with the damage that could be caused. I've never felt the battery get warm while charging, but I have felt my marine deep cycle (wet) battery get warm. Woody *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
My turn. I fit into the pattern that seems to be developing here. My background and age (45) are typical of others. I loved water sports as a kid. I started canoeing and sailing in university. Canoeing meant flatwater tripping. I learned to sail from a guy that had once been a naval architect and racer. Longest trip was from Norfolk VA to Montreal PQ via the Hudson returning a boat that a friend wintered in the Bahamas. That's where I learned navigation... and how much work sailing is. I switched to bike and cross-country ski racing and touring. After my knees blew out, I didn't do anything for a few years. Some recovery allowed me to get back to recreational skiing, but cycling is nothing but a memory. So I got back to canoeing and realized how much I'd missed. One day I wandered into the Mountain Equipment Coop store and saw a beautiful, cedar-strip kayak amidst the canoes. It was love at first sight. I found myself going back to the store just to look at her. The price tag make my knees weak however (unrelated to the old injury). My hint of Inuit ancestry (12 generations back) must have been showing through. I started talking to folks about kayaking, but didn't take any action. Then I went on a canoe trip with an odd number of people on it. Usually this means someone (usually me) paddles solo. This time the organizer got a sea kayak (this trip had no portages). I got in it the next day and disappeared down a river and into a little lake. No skirt, rudder for steering, fear of tipping over (initially) etc. The next year, between the whitewater lessons and trips, I took a sea kayaking course. I rented several different sea kayaks on weekends during the summer. After coming back from canoeing and hiking Nahanni National Park, I bought a Solstice GTH from an outfitter at their year end sale. I took it out the next day and paddled the Toronto harbour and islands from my home in the Beaches (about 30 km total). I went on the following canoe trips with my kayak, portaging (grunt) as required. I joined a sea kayak club and haven't been in a canoe since. More lessons and pool sessions have given me a good combat roll and a reasonable offside roll (though a recurring left shoulder injury make the offside iffy some days) I did take kayak WW lessons last year and definitely benefited from it. I paddle mostly in the Great Lakes (Ontario and Huron/Georgian Bay), with trips to other lakes (Algonquin) and one to Nova Scotia last summer. I look forward to returning to Gwaii Hannas (Queen Charlotte Islands BC) to kayak (last time was hiking). Also the Minganie and Saguenay, Gros Morne, Lake Superior, Ellesmere, Greenland, Scotland, ... you get the idea!! This summer will be limited in trips, since Amie and I are buying a new (expensive) house. I hope to get to the Great Lakes Symposium in Grand Marais by driving up and hold out hope of getting back to Nova Scotia to take courses with Coastal Adventures in Sept. Maybe I'll run into some of you out there on the water. Mike. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
At 11:36 AM 2/18/99 -0500, Mike Daly wrote: >(expensive) house. I hope to get to the Great Lakes Symposium in >Grand Marais by driving up and hold out hope of getting back to Nova >Scotia to take courses with Coastal Adventures in Sept. Maybe I'll >run into some of you out there on the water. I've seen several names go by on this list of people I know are planning to go to Grand Marais, have been there in the past, or might be likely to go. I'm planning on going; perhaps we ought to have a Paddlewise get- together. -- Wes *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
That's actually a great idea. But it would need someone to coordinate it. We're thinking of going, but it's by no means sure, so I can't volunteer. Any takers? On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:07:09 Wes Boyd <boydwe_at_dmci.net> writes: >At 11:36 AM 2/18/99 -0500, Mike Daly wrote: > >>(expensive) house. I hope to get to the Great Lakes Symposium in >>Grand Marais by driving up and hold out hope of getting back to Nova >>Scotia to take courses with Coastal Adventures in Sept. Maybe I'll >>run into some of you out there on the water. > >I've seen several names go by on this list of people I know are >planning >to go to Grand Marais, have been there in the past, or might be likely >to go. I'm planning on going; perhaps we ought to have a Paddlewise >get- >together. > >-- Wes > >*************************************************************************** >PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List >Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net >Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net >Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ >*************************************************************************** > ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
At 07:32 PM 2/4/99 -0500, Larry C. wrote: >What type of charger is used for Gel cell and would a solar charger work >if it was mounted on rear deck? Hi Larry, et al! The purpose of any charger is to push them li'l electrons back into the battery. If you push 'em in too fast, bad things can happen; sealed "gell-cell" batteries get hot, and may go BANG!!! As a general rule of thumb, you must limit the charging current to 1/10th of the battery's ampere-hour rating. Thus for a gell-cell rated for 1000mAH (1000 milliamp-hour, or 1 ampere-hour)the maximum charging current would be 100mA (0.1 Amp), and it would take about 10 hours to fully charge an exhausted battery. Another thing to consider is the maximum voltage available from the charging source. A nominal 12V gellcell will actually read about 13.6 volts when fully charged. You probably do not want to charge from a source that produces significantly higher voltage than this, say 14 or 15 volts max. This is one reason why your car has a voltage regulator. You can charge from pretty much any DC source if you keep the above in mind. Get a cheap voltmeter from radio shack, and as large a variable resistor as you can find. Somewhere around 50 ohm, 25 to 50 watts should be about right. Connect the source + to one end of the variable resistor, which should be set to maximum. Connect the other end to the battery +. Set the meter to read DC current, and connect the battery - to the voltmeter +, and the meter - to the source -. Now your meter is measuring the charging current. Adjust the variable resistor until you read no more than 100mA (from the above example). Remove the voltmeter from the circuit, set it to read DC volts, and connect it to read the battery voltage (meter + to batt +, meter - to batt -). Keep an eye on it, and stop charging when the voltage reaches about 13.8 to 14 volts. The voltage will drop a bit after you stop charging, but should settle in at about 13.6 volts. You can try a higher charging current, but watch the temperature of both the battery and the resistor. If either starts to get more than just slightly warm, back off! If you have access to a decent variable DC power supply you can adjust both the maximum DC voltage and the maximum current independently from the front panel. Most will even have built in meters. If you plan on doing a lot of charging different types of batteries, you might want to consider getting one. A solar cell is just another current source as far as your battery is concerned, and the same procedure applies. Many solar panels produce quite high open circuit voltages (16 - 20V) in bright sun, but this is not usually much of a problem as the voltage produced drops off sharply as you begin to draw current. Be sure to disconnect the panel before the sun goes down or it may discharge the battery. Some panels have a built-in charge controller; if you have one of these, just hook it up and go. Please note that the values I have provided are for a lead-acid chemistry, and will not be suitable for nicad or lithium batteries. Somewhere I have a more detailed discussion of this, if you're interested I will try to find it and forward a copy. Hope this helps . . . S. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Stever Jernigan wrote some good things about Gel Cells and rechargeables, but didn't quite go far enough. The current for Gel cells may need to be limited to even LESS than 1/10 the rated capacity. Also current limiting by itself is insufficient to protect the battery. Too high a voltage, even with really trivial currents can destroy a batteries capacity alarmingly quickly and insidiously. (You may never know it until you try to get the power out again ....) Temperature is also a factor in how much voltage is too-much. It can get frighteningly complicated. Additional information from .... http://www.windsun.com/Batteries/Battery_FAQ.htm http://www.usbr.gov/power/data/fist/fist3~6/fist3605.htm http://www.cadex.com/cfm/index.cfm?Pg=298&Lp=302&Db=&Mo= neal_at_bellhow.com *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
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