Hi paddlewisers, looks like sping outside. The last couple of days I looked into the electric bilge pump issue. I found the summary from last years discussion in the paddlewise www page -was before I got into kayaking. There was also an article in one of last years Seakayaker issues (August 99?). Is it worth to get this article? Right now I think about installing a Rule 500 pump with a separate battery pack (motorcycle battery or 2 connected lantern batteries) in the cockpit compartment of my stitch and glue kayak. Not sure yet if the pump goes behind the seat or into the front. Have to check were the deepest point of the cockpit is............. Any further suggestions from you? Cheers ulli P.S. I will carry a regular two hander manual pump as backup . Ulli Hoeger Dept. Physiology and Biophysics Dalhousie University Halifax, B3H4H7, Nova Scotia Canada Phone I : 902-494-2673 Fax: 902-494-1685 Phone II :902-488-6796 http://is.dal.ca/~uhoeger *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
If you are paddling in salt water I would be very careful about my battery hook up. Your pump/battery pac is going to exist in a very corrosive environment! I would avoid the motorcycle batteries as my experience with them has been disappointing. Lantern batteries or perhaps a Ni-Cad pack would be the way to go. BUT be sure that the batteries are in a watertight container and that the power leads from the pump are attached via a water proof connector to the batteries. I believe there are some hi-end crimp terminals that will do the job. As for a waterproof box.... I have not seen one for larger size batteries but perhaps some of the manufactures of waterproof flashlights can help. Richard Smith ----- Original Message ----- From: Ulli Hoeger <uhoeger_at_is.dal.ca> To: <PaddleWise_at_lists.intelenet.net> Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 2:09 PM Subject: [Paddlewise] RFI electric bilge pumps > Hi paddlewisers, > > looks like sping outside. > The last couple of days I looked into the electric bilge pump issue. > I found the summary from last years discussion in the paddlewise > www page -was before I got into kayaking. > There was also an article in one of last years Seakayaker issues > (August 99?). Is it worth to get this article? > > Right now I think about installing a Rule 500 pump with a separate > battery pack (motorcycle battery or 2 connected lantern batteries) > in the cockpit compartment of my stitch and glue kayak. Not sure > yet if the pump goes behind the seat or into the front. Have to > check were the deepest point of the cockpit is............. > > Any further suggestions from you? > > Cheers > > ulli > > P.S. I will carry a regular two hander manual pump as backup . > Ulli Hoeger > Dept. Physiology and Biophysics > Dalhousie University > Halifax, B3H4H7, Nova Scotia > Canada > > Phone I : 902-494-2673 > Fax: 902-494-1685 > Phone II :902-488-6796 > http://is.dal.ca/~uhoeger > *************************************************************************** > PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not > to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission > Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net > Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net > Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ > *************************************************************************** *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
At 06:03 AM 4/6/00 -0400, Christine Allison wrote: >I believe there are some hi-end crimp terminals that will do the job. As >for a waterproof box.... I have not seen one for larger size batteries but >perhaps some of the manufactures of waterproof flashlights can help. How about a Pelican box? *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi to Ulli, Christine, Eddie, and anyone else with the stomach to consider electric pumps again.. Ulli, you mention the Paddlewise topic page on electric pumps, http://www.paddlewise.net/topics/boatequip/elecpumps.html Here is an update on the system I described in the last post of that page. It all works well except the switch. Christine, you are absolutely right about salt water: it will corrode where it is allowed to get in. The original switches were inexpensive Radio Shack push-on push-off models that I enclosed in plastic project boxes which I attempted to seal with plastic sheeting, tape and gobs of aquarium sealer. Just a very few drops of moisture got in to both switches (Joan's and mine) and corroded them by the end of the season. Joan's switch failed in a January pool session. Mine hung in there, but I found it to be corroded when I took the assembly apart. So I went out and spent $37 each for switches that are designed to be submersible. The rest of the system, including soldered connections that were more exposed that the switches were, is intact. All the connections were sealed with silicone sealer and wrapped with tape. The battery is in a sealed plastic container within the sealed forward hatch. The battery is the sealed, "maintenance free" type. I learned that it's a good idea to vent the sealed container after use, although I have not had a problem. Apparently, gases given off by the battery can be corrosive to the terminals. These can be protected with a healthy dose of silicone grease (found in auto stores to protect trailer hitch connections). Bottom line, Ulli et al., is that the configuration that I described does work and is functional (now that the switch has been upgraded). Other systems have been successful as well. The important thing is to seal the switch and all connections carefully and to check them with reasonable regularity. Happy pumping! Bob V -----Original Message----- From: Christine Allison <sailnut_at_asan.com> To: Ulli Hoeger <uhoeger_at_is.dal.ca>; PaddleWise_at_lists.intelenet.net <PaddleWise_at_lists.intelenet.net> Date: Thursday, April 06, 2000 5:07 PM Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] RFI electric bilge pumps >If you are paddling in salt water I would be very careful about my battery >hook up. Your pump/battery pac is going to exist in a very corrosive >environment! > >I would avoid the motorcycle batteries as my experience with them has been >disappointing. Lantern batteries or perhaps a Ni-Cad pack would be the way >to go. BUT be sure that the batteries are in a watertight container and >that the power leads from the pump are attached via a water proof connector >to the batteries. > >I believe there are some hi-end crimp terminals that will do the job. As >for a waterproof box.... I have not seen one for larger size batteries but >perhaps some of the manufactures of waterproof flashlights can help. > >Richard Smith >----- Original Message ----- >From: Ulli Hoeger <uhoeger_at_is.dal.ca> >To: <PaddleWise_at_lists.intelenet.net> >Sent: Thursday, April 06, 2000 2:09 PM >Subject: [Paddlewise] RFI electric bilge pumps > > >> Hi paddlewisers, >> >> looks like sping outside. >> The last couple of days I looked into the electric bilge pump issue. >> I found the summary from last years discussion in the paddlewise >> www page -was before I got into kayaking. >> There was also an article in one of last years Seakayaker issues >> (August 99?). Is it worth to get this article? >> >> Right now I think about installing a Rule 500 pump with a separate >> battery pack (motorcycle battery or 2 connected lantern batteries) >> in the cockpit compartment of my stitch and glue kayak. Not sure >> yet if the pump goes behind the seat or into the front. Have to >> check were the deepest point of the cockpit is............. >> >> Any further suggestions from you? >> >> Cheers >> >> ulli >> >> P.S. I will carry a regular two hander manual pump as backup . >> Ulli Hoeger >> Dept. Physiology and Biophysics >> Dalhousie University >> Halifax, B3H4H7, Nova Scotia >> Canada >> >> Phone I : 902-494-2673 >> Fax: 902-494-1685 >> Phone II :902-488-6796 >> http://is.dal.ca/~uhoeger >> >*************************************************************************** >> PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and >not >> to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission >> Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net >> Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net >> Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ >> >*************************************************************************** > >*************************************************************************** >PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not >to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission >Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net >Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net >Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ >*************************************************************************** > *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
John Fereira, in discussing waterproofing electric pump batteries, asked, "How about a Pelican box?" This was my plan, too. But, in discussions with the manufacturers of my lead acid battery, a point was made that these batteries will vent a toxic gas --- hydrogen sulphide, I believe --- when they discharge. The manufacturer strongly recommended not placing his batteries in a drybox; in another application, a rescue service placed a battery for a piece of emergency gear --- probably "jaws of life" --- for use in a marine environment, and the box exploded, causing some minor damage. Now, that apparatus could well have dr *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
You could consider a Gell cell which are not subject to spillage but picky about charging. Richard Smith ----- Original Message ----- From: <JCMARTIN43_at_aol.com> To: <jaf30_at_cornell.edu>; <paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net> Sent: Friday, April 07, 2000 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] RFI electric bilge pumps > John Fereira, in discussing waterproofing electric pump batteries, asked, "How about a Pelican box?" > > This was my plan, too. But, in discussions with the manufacturers of my lead acid battery, a point was made that these batteries will vent a toxic gas --- hydrogen sulphide, I believe --- when they discharge. The manufacturer strongly recommended not placing his batteries in a drybox; in another application, a rescue service placed a battery for a piece of emergency gear --- probably "jaws of life" --- for use in a marine environment, and the box exploded, causing some minor damage. Now, that apparatus could well have dr > > *************************************************************************** > PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not > to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission > Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net > Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net > Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ > *************************************************************************** *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I have been experimenting with an electric bilge pump system for two years. Like Bob, I found the switch to be the weak link in the system. For the past year I have been using a SPDT switch with a rubber boot over the toggle. In addition to using the immersion safe waterproof switch, I mounted the switch on the rear deck so that the guts of the switch are in the rear compartment. The switch mechanism is further protected by enclosing it and a fuse in a 10 oz. round plastic food container. My 7 AH gel cell battery is mounted in the rear compartment as well. My pump is a Rule 1100. I have had no problems with leakage or corrosion with this setup. I paddle in freshwater except for winter pool sessions, so I cannot speak to saltwater corrosion. I did have a AA battery pack for my compass light fail due to corrosion from chlorinated pool water. I will be enclosing this battery pack in a waterproof box. Motorcycle batteries have liquid electrolyte and will spill sulfuric acid out of the vent tube when they are tipped. Gel Cell batteries are vented through a valve and have their electrolyte in a gel form. One trade off for the gel electrolyte is that the batteries cannot sustain high draw as well as the liquid electrolyte batteries can, however I have not had a problem with the battery overheating during use. In my new boat I am intending to use a 2 AH gel cell battery. I also found a sealed switch designed for use on jet skeets <g> at West Marine for $38 US. For those who want further redundancy on battery protection there are rigid plastic boxes available from Campmor that will fit a 7 AH gel cell. I have seen a box branded as an Otter Box that might be big enough for this battery. The key to what I think is a successful electric pump system is putting the vulnerable components, switch, battery, fuse and connections in a relatively dry environment and using redundant protection where ever feasible. Dana -----Original Message----- Date: Thu, 6 Apr 2000 22:20:08 -0400 From: "Bob Volin" <bobvolin_at_bestweb.net> Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] RFI electric bilge pumps Hi to Ulli, Christine, Eddie, and anyone else with the stomach to consider electric pumps again.. Ulli, you mention the Paddlewise topic page on electric pumps, http://www.paddlewise.net/topics/boatequip/elecpumps.html Here is an update on the system I described in the last post of that page. It all works well except the switch. Christine, you are absolutely right about salt water: it will corrode where it is allowed to get in. The original switches were inexpensive Radio Shack push-on push-off models that I enclosed in plastic project boxes which I attempted to seal with plastic sheeting, tape and gobs of aquarium sealer. Just a very few drops of moisture got in to both switches (Joan's and mine) and corroded them by the end of the season. Joan's switch failed in a January pool session. Mine hung in there, but I found it to be corroded when I took the assembly apart. So I went out and spent $37 each for switches that are designed to be submersible. The rest of the system, including soldered connections that were more exposed that the switches were, is intact. All the connections were sealed with silicone sealer and wrapped with tape. The battery is in a sealed plastic container within the sealed forward hatch. The battery is the sealed, "maintenance free" type. I learned that it's a good idea to vent the sealed container after use, although I have not had a problem. Apparently, gases given off by the battery can be corrosive to the terminals. These can be protected with a healthy dose of silicone grease (found in auto stores to protect trailer hitch connections). Bottom line, Ulli et al., is that the configuration that I described does work and is functional (now that the switch has been upgraded). Other systems have been successful as well. The important thing is to seal the switch and all connections carefully and to check them with reasonable regularity. Happy pumping! Bob V *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Why not use hand power for the bilge pump. Itīs always available. >Tor *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
"Why not use hand power for the bilge pump. Itīs always available." When you need the pump most, you need both hands on the paddle. Regards, PT. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
10) I originally put an electric pump my boat just to see if I could find a way to make one work. 9) An electric bilge pump is faster than a manual pump. 8) An electric bilge pump is less expensive than a foot pump. 7) An electric bilge pump is lighter than a foot pump. 6) Using an electric allows me to focus on keeping my boat stable while the motor does the work. 5) An electric pump will work when I'm too cold to work. 4) An electric pump will work when I'm too tired to work. 3) Pumping out a kayak full of sloshing water with the pump stuck down the spray skirt tube an interesting hypothesis but lousy in practice. 2) I need two hands to operate a hand pump and two hands to brace with a paddle. 1) I can post on the recurring PW questions about electric bilge pumps and write with some knowledge <g>. Dana -----Original Message----- Date: Mon, 10 Apr 2000 09:05:26 +0200 From: "Dalberg, Tor" <Tor.Dalberg_at_dnv.com> Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] RFI electric bilge pumps Why not use hand power for the bilge pump. Itīs always available. >Tor *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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