RE: I do have a question for you and other Paddlewisers... in a "group paddle" how do you deal with the "dawdlers', especially if it affects the safety of the group as a whole? I didn't see any replies to this, maybe because there is not a "polite" method to reprimand those more interested in conversation than paddling. Nothing is more frustrating than trying to reach shore or sheltered area when conditions are worsening, only to be caught waiting for people who are lagging behind due to their lack of effort. Very tough decision to choose their safety over your own, especially when the "fight or flight" adrenaline is kicking in. Blowing a whistle and waving your arms may not be enough - even if profanity is added. A stern pre-paddle speech by the chosen leader may help prevent this. Would it be best to split a large group into different speeds of smaller groups to ensure no one is left alone? Tim boat'n in the Ozarks *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I would suggest whips and cattle prods to get your members going. Then, if that doesn't work, fire a couple of warning shots across their bows. Could I suggest a few deck mounted cannons? *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Sounds like a chance to test those flares. Seriously this thread was well discussed earlier this year. The consensus seemed to be that the trip leader must take inot account all paddlers in the group when planning crossings and other potentially hazardous trips. Sometimes a quick discussion of the hazard that they are oblivious to helps, but not always. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
NEWTOT_at_mail.modot.state.mo.us wrote: > > RE: I do have a question for you and other Paddlewisers... in a "group paddle" > how do you deal with the "dawdlers', especially if it affects the safety of > the group as a whole? > > I didn't see any replies to this, maybe because there is not a "polite" method > to reprimand those more interested in conversation than paddling. Nothing is > more frustrating than trying to reach shore or sheltered area when conditions > are worsening, only to be caught waiting for people who are lagging behind due > to their lack of effort. [snip] Can't help with the mulligan stew situation common to "club" paddles -- I don't do those, but maybe there is some help in my tactic for dealing with *one* slow partner. I've had this experience twice in the last year, and with the same individual (LS). In LS's case, his "dawdling" is not an act of rebellion or contrariness -- it is just the pace he feels comfortable with. LS is the kind of guy who is set in his ways, but not nasty or defensive about it -- he just does not paddle with much **effort** -- maybe half what I consider my "cruising" degree of effort. Yeah, it is frustrationg, and can lead to more risk than we tolerate. The underscored word is the aspect I wish to explore, because there is a very insidious consequence: the *net* speed a paddler can maintain is a more or less direct function of the **difference** between the force the paddler exerts in the forward direction, and the forces of drag and wind resistance exerted on the paddler-boat system in the reverse direction. When fighting adverse wind (the most usual problem) or adverse current, this means my slow buddy can quickly get into a situation where a crossing that is a half-hour commitment for me might be a **two hour** commitment for him. That's a real problem, because he has to work for four times longer than I do!! And, if conditions are worsening, his risk is much greater than mine -- and if I stay with him (got to, no?), my risk is increased, also. What's my solution? Well, I really can not change this guy's ways, so: 1. I do not paddle with him much. 2. I only commit myself to helping him across the "crux" of a given paddle trip -- and spell out my commitment clearly *in advance* of the trip. Number two means we do not do multi-day trips together, although we have paddled (each with our own partners -- nobody is soloing) in the same general area over a several-day timespan, with me "assisting" the guy to a safe spot from which he can explore at his own pace, and then helping him back over that spot as we return to our launch point. OTOH, if I were paddling with someone who was purposefully paddling with low effort (but who *could* up the pace easily), in the face of threatening conditions, they would get the full force of my best persuasive talents, and I'd be damn sure that was the last trip I did with them! I might mention that LS is very grateful for the time or two I have helped him over a crux -- in fact he would not be able to explore some cool places without my help -- and his gratitude is what keeps me in the game. He is almost a decade older than I am, and I hope in 10 years there is a kind hearted boomer baby who will do the same for me! <g> -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR sometime curmudgeon, sometimes not *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
>>I do have a question for you and other Paddlewisers... in a "group paddle" >>how do you deal with the "dawdlers', especially if it affects the safety of >>the group as a whole? My best advice is to choose your paddling companions with care. However, if you're leading a class or club trip, where you don't get to choose your mates, a stern pre-paddle speech is probably the best remedy. Maybe for longer trips, the last one to the beach has to empty the "boom box" (but anyone arriving far ahead of the group gets to help them!) or similar undesirable chore. If you had the luxury of multiple skilled leaders, it wouldn't be a bad idea to split a larger group into faster and slower sets. -- Shawn W. Baker 0 46°53'N © 2000 ____©/______ 114°06'W ~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^\ ,/ /~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^~^ baker_at_montana.com 0 http://www.geocities.com/shawnkayak/ *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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