As glad as I am that Jack's experience on Mt. Bachelor ended happily, I think he misses a vitally important distinction between on-the-water rescues and the kind of rescue he almost needed. Jack made a concious decision to ignore postings warning him of the cost of his risky behavior. One of the sea's greatest attractions is its very lack of lane markers (outside of harbors and other congested areas)and the freedom to venture where one pleases. I can't imagine any tyro making a decision to risk his life. Bad decision-making is based on lack of experience. Conversely, much of our most valuable experience is based on past bad decision-making. Some of us are more careful-lucky-blessed than others, apparently. The high-handed rant from Down Under about paid rescues smacks of frat boy hazing mentality: "you have no business here until you've suffered the outrages I have." Doug Lloyd's experience in his Storm Island account is common: most people resist summoning help until their situation is desperate. Adding a financial disincentive can only further imperil the safety of a few. Even if they are foolhardy and inexperienced,they're seeking what some of us are fortunate enough to have found. Should they risk paying with their lives because they're reluctant to pay with their wallets? The same inexperience that put them in danger's way may cause them to resist doing the sensible thing when it counts. The Coast Guard is most directly comparable to police and fire services. Can you imagine the messes resulting from a user-pay system? It's like insurance: we all contribute in advance, paying for the availability of services we fervently hope never to need. Speaking of messes, I think we'd be asking to dive headlong into the same quagmire that represents our civil judicial system if we began to try to assess degrees of responsibility after the fact. Aside from the legal wrangles, it would inevitably (and quickly) result in the same liability fears that already govern much conduct. We could expect closed put-ins, high use fees, shoreside safety checks. Should that happen, it'll be time for some of us to swap our boats for something that once again offers us a few hours of real freedom to make our own decisions and take our own risks. I'm confident I'll never need the services of the Coast Guard, just as I'm confident that I'll never make a claim on my fire insurance. Just the same, I'm glad I have access to both. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 10/3/00 7:46:44 PM !!!First Boot!!!, paxtonm_at_hotmail.com writes: << As glad as I am that Jack's experience on Mt. Bachelor ended happily, I think he misses a vitally important distinction between on-the-water rescues and the kind of rescue he almost needed. Jack made a concious decision to ignore postings warning him of the cost of his risky behavior. >> Having lived around water and professional water people my entire life. My Father was retired Navy, my wife's family has operated commercial vessels on the St. Johns River (FL) since the mid 1800s and an article in the local newspaper today features my son in law's family for operating commercially in St. Augustine for five generations. I believe that latecomers to the waters, in general, do not apreciate that "every time that you put on to the water you are putting yourself at risk." Granted the risks are not always equal and preparedness and prudence can definitely work in your favor. The posted warning is the shoreline. We no longer "breathe" water, we are land based mammals. Each time that we put on the water we are engaging in risky behavior. Learn it, live it. Bruce McC WEO *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Mark said The high-handed rant from Down Under about paid rescues smacks of frat boy hazing mentality: "you have no business here until you've suffered the outrages I have." Hey Mark don't associate the rest of us paddlers down under with Laurie Fords writings - he is in a world of his own and has probably offended every other paddler and club in Australia. David Whyte Australia *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 10/3/00 3:46:44 PM, paxtonm_at_hotmail.com writes: << Should they risk paying with their lives because they're reluctant to pay with their wallets? The same inexperience that put them in danger's way may cause them to resist doing the sensible thing when it counts. >> dollars to donuts 99% of those who called wouldn't know they would be charged. <<t. Aside from the legal wrangles, it would inevitably (and quickly) result in the same liability fears that already govern much conduct. We could expect closed put-ins, high use fees, shoreside safety checks. Should that happen, it'll be time for some of us to swap our boats for something that once again offers us a few hours of real freedom to make our ...>> I ride horses and have a hell of a time finding a place to ride without paying through the nose for the MOST controlled ride you can imagine. I can easily see all rentals being kiwis on days with under 2 mph of wind and only being allowed 90 minutes out because I was "experienced" instead of the usual 60 minutes out for $45. Insurance has all but cut off horseback riding as a rental option unless it is for long term leases circumscribed by miryad legal caveats. I'd hate to see paddling on the Bay as a victim of our need to either be "110% assured we are safe or we will sue "thinking. Joan Spinner who lived within the DC Beltway and really does listen to all that NPR stuff about how we act *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
A well thought out and written commentary by Mr. Paxton. The statement below brings to mind: "He said. They thought. But, would you believe?" Hindsight is always 20/20 and who better to tell the poor soul (victim) that they could have done better after the fact than a giant bill for a rescue. You can only get as much justice (or should it read: rescue) as you can afford. Thanks Fred At 11:51 AM 10/3/2000 -0700, Mark Paxton wrote: >dive headlong into the same quagmire that represents our civil judicial >system if we began to try to assess degrees of responsibility after the fact. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
"Fred T, CA Kayaker" wrote: > > A well thought out and written commentary by Mr. Paxton. > > [snip] Hindsight is always 20/20 and who better to tell the poor > soul (victim) that they could have done better after the fact than a giant > bill for a rescue. You can only get as much justice (or should it read: > rescue) as you can afford. > At 11:51 AM 10/3/2000 -0700, Mark Paxton wrote: [we will] > >dive headlong into the same quagmire that represents our civil judicial > >system if we began to try to assess degrees of responsibility after the fact. Normally I resist "me, too!" endorsements. I can't resist this one, however. Mark's post really nailed the negative aspects of an "admiralty inquiry" focused on a person's need for a rescue. Yet, in casual conversation with non-boaters (including folks who have kayaked some), the almost universal response to the question "Well, who determines whether there should be a fee for the rescue?" is: **A committee.** AFAIK, the CG around here is not assessing a fee for rescues. However, if they discover after the fact that the rescued boater was in violation of some of the safety-related rules, they seem to make sure the boater is cited for those violations (re: PFDs on board, etc.). I have several friends who are commercial fishers who had to be rescued (mostly from collisions with freighters), and assessment of their vessel is one of the normal components of the CG's report. 'Course, when the vessel sinks, it's tougher to do that! In most cases requiring a tow, the CG points boaters in a non-emergent situation to a commercial tow. However, they do tows often, the mouth of the Columbia River being a high-hazard area. We get our money's worth from the local CG. -- Dave Kruger Astoria, OR *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - All postings copyright the author and not to be reproduced/forwarded outside PaddleWise without author's permission Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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