I'm not certain if there are special techniques required for teaching the roll to larger paddlers. However, I have read the posts and have a comment regarding use of hips and the term "hip snap." Personally, when I teach the roll I don't use the term or mention righting of a capsized kayak with use of the hip. I do use the term "rolling knee" and "rolling thigh." I've discussed this among fellow instructors I teach with and they agree; concentration of the righting motion should be on the rolling knee. I feel lower body practice for the roll ought to be focused on the student's rolling knee and be done on the side of a pool, bow of another kayak or using the hands of the instructor who should be standing in shallow water. The Kent Ford video is a great starting point and teaching aid. I've viewed it many times and the term Hip Snap is not mentioned. The technique and use of the knee in the video has been pivotal in my learning eleven different rolls (both sides), sculling up (both sides) and extreme high brace recovery with body in water (both sides). One last remark. The three biggest setbacks in achievement of a solid roll are: 1) Not sweeping beyond 90 degrees before torso rotation - resulting in pulling on the paddle and 2) Not having rotated the boat 90 degrees on its roll axis by the time torso sweep is converted to torso rotation and 3) Gripping the paddle tightly while having more or less then zero pitch angle of the paddle blade to the water. Good paddling and successful rolling, Ed DeBee http://users3.ev1.net/~edebee/ *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Rich, Correct me if I'm wrong here: But in the sweep roll that Kent teaches in his video, they don't advocate or suggest finishing lying on the back deck, right? If they do, maybe this is why I can't get it!! :o) I may have missed that nuance of this thing! Keith *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I'm far from any expert but I thought a sweep finished on the back deck. I can't imagine how else you can end it if it sweeps behind your hip. Joan Correct me if I'm wrong here: But in the sweep roll that Kent teaches in his video, they don't advocate or suggest finishing lying on the back deck, right? *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
But in the 'alternate rolls' section towards the end, they make it a point to show a roll ending on the back and then explain why they don't necessarily advocate this method (although they do say that there are LOTS of good rolls out there - learn several). It finishes with a torso twist that places the blade behind you...but you aren't laid out on the back deck. Some of the rolls shown in the video have the paddler leaning back slightly as they finish - but most don't seem overly tipped back (from what I recall). At 05:12 PM 3/23/03 -0500, you wrote: >I'm far from any expert but I thought a sweep finished on the back deck. I >can't imagine how else you can end it if it sweeps behind your hip. > >Joan >Correct me if I'm wrong here: But in the sweep roll that Kent teaches in >his video, they don't advocate or suggest finishing lying on the back deck, >right? Keith Wrage 1925 Sandalwood Drive Onalaska, WI 54650 (608) 781-3441 (608) 317-7550 (cell) *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On Sun, Mar 23, 2003 at 03:59:52PM -0600, Keith Wrage wrote: > Correct me if I'm wrong here: But in the sweep roll that Kent teaches in > his video, they don't advocate or suggest finishing lying on the back deck, > right? If they do, maybe this is why I can't get it!! :o) I may have > missed that nuance of this thing! And it may have been too long since I've watched that particular video: I'll have to find it, drop it in, and watch it again. The sweep roll that I learned ends up with the paddle in the same position that it would be at the end of an ordinary forward sweep: nearly parallel to the boat. The body ends up arched back over the back deck. I actually *do* use this roll under very special conditions: when playing in deep water where I know (a) there is no chance of hitting the bottom and (b) if I miss it, I'll have plenty of time to set up and roll again before washing into anything. Mostly I do it sporadically just so I don't forget it. ;-) I use the C-to-C roll under all other circumstances, though, because if I'm upside-down, I probably got that way because some river feature pounded me and left me that way. My goal is thus to get up FAST before something even worse happens, to keep my face protected while it's down there, and to come up in a position that leaves me prepared to take a hard forward stroke immediately. BTW: I should have probably mentioned some of the other exercises that I do: one is to take my feet off the footbraces and my knees off the pads. This means that I can't use my lower legs and have to rely entirely on my hips -- I find it useful for isolating and training those muscles. Another is to blow the skirt and roll the boat several times -- it gets much harder and this usually ends with a swim to the side of the pool. Another is to set up left, then re-set up right and roll; another is to flip, pass the paddle over the top (hull) of the boat and roll; and another is to do 5 left, 5 right as rapidly as possible. Everybody has little games like this: I think all of them help turn the roll into a reflex action and to make it more reliable. They're also kind of fun. Now my C-1 roll...well, let's just say that it's rather an iffy thing at this point. ;-) ---Rsk *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi Mark, I'm 42, or so my kids tell me, 5' 10" and 215 lbs. I've signed up for rolling clases April 6, so I'll be better able to tell you then. I did however manage to get off five C to C rolls last year in the basic class on my "wrong side", that being my left side, as I'm right handed. On my strong right side, I just kind of flounder about, and it feels hopeless. Same thing with martial art classes. My left side had to focus on technique, as my supposedly stronger right side kind of muscles its way through moves. But in practice hitting, everyone told me my left side is strongest! Really annoying. Its been a while since I've practiced martial arts, so I'm not that flexible, so my hip snap isn't really strong. But a couple of those rolls were done fluidly enough to nearly roll over to the other side again. Anyway, as long as you have an instructor who can show you proper technique, and you are persistent, you should be able to sucessfully roll. I wasn't keen on goggles, and nose clips, but they make you more comfortable while being upside down, so you are able to orient yourself better, so you can concentrate on technique, so use those too. Paul >From: "Mark Sanders" <sandmarks_at_attbi.com> I'd like to know if there's any big kayakers > > out there who have a really good roll. I'm 46, 6' 265lbs and I'm >wondering if it's really feasable to think I'm ever really going to be able >to muscle my way upright. _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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