Elias Ross wrote: But if boat designs were protected by law, I think there is a chance there would community developing around producing "community designs." Whether or not they would be developed commercially or just by hobbists is a good question. (And I am not here to advocate boat designers do such a thing if there were such a law, or condemn or push those who don't.) The reason that people do not give back as you describe, is there is no such obligation under law. And there is no "enabling technology" in place that allows for information to be shared and updated easily. (This mailing list is a good example!) There are "communities" of boatbuilders that do work in pretty much this way. They are the "development" classes of sailboats, where the limitations are very broad (typically, max. length, beam, sail area) but within this, pretty much anything goes. The Sydney Harbour 18's are one example of this. They tend to be communities of hobbyists, although certainly the best designers can make a business out of it by applying the concepts they have developed to new one-designs, as Julian Bethwaite has. Rob. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I said (big snip): >Some design insiration. Anyone knoe the story on this? http://www.qajaqusa.org/gallery/New_Zealand/Tutakaka_flyer Shawn in a Night Herron (a kit boat with rat promise. Anywone lnow its capacity? http://www.qajaqusa.org/gallery/New_Zealand/shawn_spine_rolling Sorry about the poor spelling on the above post. I type super fast, then usually hit spell check and fix the miss-keyed text (usually works out faster in the end). Obviously forgot the spell check. Anyway, I do like the Night Heron from what I can see of it, and it can be made out of ply or strip, according to Nick's site. If I went the total build-from-plan route, this boat shows some promise. I'd appreciate anyone who knows its capacity (litres, etc). Also, does anyone hove the volume specs on the Outer Island? Doug Lloyd Victoria BC *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi Doug, I never managed to get details on the Tutakaka flyer but yes it does have an interesting and unique hull. If you want to try posting a message on http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/NZkayakbuilders/ somebody maybe able to answer your question. I am not sure who the builder is. The Celeste mentioned in your other posting is also made by a local designer. The hull is a fast design and just by looking at it you know it will move! Unsure how it measures up tracking wise, but since it was designed by a kayak racer and is often used for this purpose I would consider it a good tracker. Most kayaks here in NZ have rudders so the addition of one is meaningless for a kiwi design (it may or may not need it). The only thing I personally didn't like about the Celeste was the high peaked deck (Pygmy like). The deck can be easily changed and there is one currently being built with a low profile deck on it. Email me direct and I will try to find the contact details of the builder for you. grantglazer_at_clear.net.nz The Night Heron Shawn used in the rolling demo is my own. "Aihe" is the Greenland deck version of Nicks strip NH. More pictures are available at http://home.clear.net.nz/pages/grantglazer/NHGD/NHGD5.htm As a play boat its great :) Very manouverable and fantastic for rolling etc. Nick states on his site that the volume of the low deck version is 73.3 galleons, for the Greenland deck you can probably deduct another 10gal off this. From the keel line to the top of the aft coaming rim it is only 14cm high. In other words its not a camping kayak but still has more then enough room for day tripping. I have yet to take it out in very rough conditions but have no worries about the hull shape for surfing or handling chop. The ultra low aft deck may be slow to shed water in large waves. Cheers Grant *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On 16 Aug 2004 at 18:47, Grant Glazer wrote: > Hi Doug, > > I never managed to get details on the Tutakaka Something tells me that with a name sounding like this, it wouldn't sell in Italy. Mike *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Grant replied (snip): >I never managed to get details on the Tutakaka flyer but yes it does have an interesting and unique hull.< I assume the Tutakaka flyer in a pseudo-replica of a Baffin Island kayak, with the rudder and what appears to be a strip deck being the factors against true replication. From what I understand, these Baffin designs were super-gear load carriers (up to half a ton deck loads) and often built to 20 t0 25 feet LOA. I like the bow; would be kind of neat to do a SOF one day, as most SOF are Greenland, Baidarka, etc. Perhaps we'll leave off the rudder, though the Baffin yaks of old look like they were almost intended for a perfect modern rudder addition, as there is no stern sheer, just a blunt end on some of them. >I have yet to take it out in very rough conditions but have no worries about the hull shape for surfing or handling chop. The ultra low aft deck may be slow to shed water in large waves.< (The Night Heron - Doug) I noticed some web sites claim the Greenland SOF's should be used in fiords and inlets only. Hadn't heard that before. Jay claims the Outer Island (similar design characteristics) is fine up to 5 or 6 foot waves, at least he hasn't had any real issues in waves that size. Not sure if the former implies the Baffin kayaks were used in bigger water. Probably on the wrong list for these questions. There's just tons of aspects to kayaking, eh? Doesn't sound like the dedicated paddler can ever get boarded with the sport and history. Or the boat copying legal issues. :-) Thanks for the referenced sites and info. MUCH appreciated. Doug Lloyd Victoria BC *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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