G'Day, There's a fairly well known method for finding north using an analog wrist watch. The watch is held horizontal and rotated until 12 o'clock faces the sun, or the shadow cast by the sun on a stick perpendicular to the watch face centre, falls over 6 o'clock. Then in the southern hemisphere north is found by bisecting the angle between 12 o'clock and the hour hand. This has to be done with the watch set to standard not daylight saving time. The technique can be in error by up to 30 degrees because of seasonal changes in daylight hours. Can anyone tell me if it would be more accurate to proceed as follows? Start off by calculating the time of day midway between sun rise and sunset (T1 in 24 hour format). Then calculate T2 (12 hr format) = (Time of day [24 hr format] - 12 - T1). Then orient the watch so that T1 faces the sun and bisect the angle between T1 and T2. Of course this method is still going to be very inaccurate compared to a compass but are there Paddlewisers who would know if it adequately compensates for seasonal variation. Theres at least one astronomer out there in Lurkerland:~) With the weather getting colder up north I'm also hoping there are Paddlewiser's with time to contribute some other unconventional or minimalist navigation techniques? All the best, PeterO *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On 27.11.2006 10:57, PeterO wrote: > With the weather getting colder up north I'm also hoping there are > Paddlewiser's with time to contribute some other unconventional or > minimalist navigation techniques? Anthills! Ants are building hills (houses) here in Scandinavia mainly of conifer needles. The anthills are always built on the southside of trees, stones and other obstructions considered by the ant-mind to last at least the time of the ant-society's life span. But of course; to find the ants you have to leave the water for a while. Aage *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
PeterO wrote: > The > technique can be in error by up to 30 degrees because of seasonal changes in > daylight hours. ??? 30 degrees is two hours of sun movement. The only significant change in time that I can think of is the equation of time and that only varies by about 30 minutes (+16, -14 or so). Are you confusing the 30 minutes with thirty degrees? > Can anyone tell me if it would be more accurate to proceed as follows? Start > off by calculating the time of day midway between sun rise and sunset (T1 in > 24 hour format). Then calculate T2 (12 hr format) = (Time of day [24 hr > format] - 12 - T1). Then orient the watch so that T1 faces the sun and > bisect the angle between T1 and T2. Sounds about right. If you want more accuracy, use local and not standard time - in other words, shift by the number of minutes of time between your longitude and the nearest standard time longitude (15 degrees of longitude = 1 hour). For example, I live about 17 minutes west of the standard time longitude, so the standard time for noon is 17 minutes off the true local time. You can also take into account the equation of time. I've never been too keen on these watch-based approaches. Depending on where you live and when you do it, it can be unreliable. For example, if you are in north Australia and the sun is on the Tropic of Capricorn, you'd have a hard time reliably locating the sun as "north". If you are on the tropic on that day, the sun is directly overhead and you can't use it at all (you end up standing in your shadow). That said, I usually just look at the sun and note the time (correcting for DST). Then I figure out the time difference to noon and then figure out the distance the sun has to travel (morning) or has traveled (afternoon) relative to noon (15 degrees per hour) and mentally swing that off to find south. As an aid, your palm, at arms length, is about 10 degrees wide. This is more useful in a world of digital watch displays. Mike *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Michael Daly wrote: > That said, I usually just look at the sun and note the time (correcting > for DST). Then I figure out the time difference to noon and then figure > out the distance the sun has to travel (morning) or has traveled > (afternoon) relative to noon (15 degrees per hour) and mentally swing > that off to find south. I forgot to mention that the "swing" is along the ecliptic (path of the sun in the sky) not along the horizon. Mike *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
> There's a fairly well known method for finding north using an analog wrist > watch. ... The technique can be in error by up to 30 degrees because of seasonal changes in > daylight hours. > ??? Around here in NJ we think more in terms of finding South (for us) with an annual error of 6 degrees. Still good enough for rough navigation. > Start off by calculating the time of day midway between sun rise and sunset (T1 in > 24 hour format). Then calculate T2 (12 hr format) = (Time of day [24 hr > format] - 12 - T1). Then orient the watch so that T1 faces the sun and > bisect the angle between T1 and T2. Yes, this will work BUT!!! If you have the foresight to be carrying an almanac with the required information, then why the hell aren't you carrying a compass? A propos of the survival situation wherein you don't have a compass and your watch doesn't work; How about the stick and string method? Sometime before noon put a stick in the ground and note the shadow of the tip. From there with a string trace an arc around for some distance. Mark it again when the tip shadow hits that line again some time after noon. Measure the distance between the two crossings with the string leaving a straight line between the two points, put the folded-in-half string back on that straight line, then draw a line between that point and the base of the stick. That should be your N-S line (or noon line) pretty closely. Joe P. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
G'day Joe, Mike and Avner, Don't think I could have asked for a better set of responses - and be sure I will try them all out: - Avner/s because its so darn practical. Mike's because it will make me think hard and Joe's because it sounds elegant and I'm keen on navigation with string and sticks. Thanks again and all the best, PeterO *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Joe wrote: - >Yes, this will work BUT!!! If you have the foresight >to be carrying an almanac with the required information, >then why the hell aren't you carrying a compass? G'Day, Ok you've caught me out and so I was trolling and thought you would never ask:~) Its a good question and the answer lies with an acquaintance I first met some years ago in Skiffies. Skiffies is a Sydney waterfront bar frequented by sailors, kayakers and other disreputable folk. We used to meet there of a Thursday night after an evening paddle. Sometimes travellers like Natalie Wiest would join and enliven the evening with stories of exotic and foreign lands. One windy winter's evening about two years ago I was at Skiffies drowning my regrets on being alone with a glass or two of warm beer when a tall, lean and grizzled fellow joined me. He turned out to be an ex-kayaker and further had paddled a Pittarak, so clearly was a man of discernment and culture despite his shaggy grey hair and unshaved, unkempt appearance. A man also of ripe vocabulary and even riper vaguely sulfurous smell, with the additional oddity that he would not take his gloves off. We got to talking about close calls in our boats and I found from my limited stock a story or two on being run down in the harbour and crossing between islands in Bass Strait in the fog. They made very little impact. Then he struck up with his own - it's worth repeating, there are several valuable lessons. Mate, he said you think thats a close call let me tell you about the most ill considered decision I've ever made - gave up the sea because of it. It was on Hook Island in the Whitsundays where I was camping for no other reason than it bore my name (Jim Hook was how he introduced himself showing me some sort of naval commission, something to do with a Letter of Marque, which I have to say was the most dog eared and yellowed certificate I've ever seen). Anyway mate, he continued, twas evening and the Pittarak was drifting down Nara inlet while I studied sea eagles perched on the hoop pine and wondered what kind of possum would make the mud slides that occurred every so often between the mangroves. A quiet spot and very isolated. And then of a sudden I hear this faint click behind me. Nothing happens for a while and then there it goes again - click click; quite regular now and a bit louder. And of a sudden theres a swirl of water and what I thought was a log starts swimming gracefully around the boat, clicking all the time. Its a saltwater croc mate. But its OK looks fairly docile, quite unaggressive in fact. And theres my first mistake! Years ago a professor told me that even the politest of sharks or saltwater crocs circling your boat is no more innocent than a young lad curiously doing the rounds of a christmas buffet, just waiting to devour the pudding. Like a flippant fool I ignored this sage advice and continued to study the swimming log. It circled me twice and just as I was beginning to feel an affection for the critter, me being lonely an all, up it leaps and barges full tilt into the boat. Mate I was shocked that old #$!#%#$ Inverbon was right after all. I'm back paddling me fastest and this horrible beast is smiling its toothy grin waiting for the next rush. Which comes too quickly. Its got its cavernous jaws opening and I'm peering in despair at hell waiting at the end of the crimson, mucous lined, tooth filled tunnel opening before me. Mind racing ...time to fire a flare into its gaping maw? - NO the blamed flares are in the back of my PFD. But theres bungee stretched across the deck and I whip my feet up to hold the cord off the boat, pull the center of the cord back and there it is! A catapult ready for action but nothing nearby for a missile, except either a small handcompass or an almanac which I always carry under the bungee. Figured the compass was the go as I had another on the deck anyway. So set this expensive missile in the bungee, let go and THWACK it fires and hits that ole croc squarely in the epiglottis. The Jaws clamp shut and down its head crashes straight onto my deck compass. It crosses its eyes, retches, sets its jaws to the sky retches again and coughing violently shoots out a silvery looking object into the blue yonder. Then shaking pieces of compass housing from its blood stained throat, gives a despondent look at the lost meal and silently slips away. Silence..... then a whistling, think for a moment it's a canon ball but look up and theres that silver instrument heading straight at me. One hand grasps the paddle and braces like fury the other stretches across, leans and HOWZAT caught it - Years playing cricket for Yorkshire finally pay off. Turns out the critter had once swallowed and now thrown up, a Lange & Sohne marine chronometer! And just as well because I'd lost both my compasses and the almanack had slid off the deck into the briny so the devils own luck gives me a clock to measure the time of sunrise, sunset, set up a compass and find my way home. But still on a dark winters night while paddling those murky waters a cold chill creeps down my spine at the thought that I will no longer hear a warning "tic toc tic" while the croc creeps up behind me. The old guy winks at me, picks up my beer in his claw, drains it with a gulp and is gone. All the best, PeterO With apologies to: JM Barrie, Professor Inverbon, Natalie and all of Paddlewise for detaining you so long:~) *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Does it get any better? Awesome story....I mean factual account. Jim et al *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Arrhh mate... splendid yarn. :) Thankee. Craig Jungers Royal City, WA The old guy winks at me, picks up my beer in his claw, drains it with a gulp > and is gone. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Great story! *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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