I don't share the general prejudice against double kayaks. I certainly enjoy being captan of my own ship, but I think doubles add a wonderful dimension to the sport. Safety is greatly enhanced with a double on a trip. It makes a terrific rescue platform and, as was pointed out, it can be a way to move a disabled paddler along where towing or staying put would have been necessary otherwise. Doubles can be very fast, since there is twice the horsepower without twice the boat. Doubles can be sociable, if you know how to get along with your partner. (But it is really hard for the stern paddler to hear the bow paddler most of the time.) My wife and I used to teach a class called "Couples in Doubles" hoping to get people to not kill each other in a double. The simplest technique was to require everyone to paddle with someone else's spouse/partner the first time and then with their own the next. We tend to treat total strangers better than people we care about in times of stress. Treating the spouse as a stranger helped. But, unfortunately, old habits die hard and the class was usually not very successful. The adventure therapy trips I lead with teens have all the kiddies in doubles. Stable, more power and, best of all, they have to work on cooperation, communication and teamwork. And teaching the forward stroke is easier in a double, I think, because the stern paddler has the example of the instructor right in front of them all the time to imitate. The last thing is that I can take raw beginners on long or challenging paddles and not have to freak them out by putting them in a single. My favorite way to introduce people to the beauty of the Chicago skyline is to take them out in Lake Michigan in my double. Seen from the lake on a nice evening the city looks pretty good. Jim Tibensky *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
James wrote: > I don't share the general prejudice against double kayaks. I certainly > enjoy being captan of my own ship, but I think doubles add a wonderful > dimension to the sport. I've seen a list like this before. You can also add... When paddling a tandem it doesn't matter if one paddler is much stronger than the other; you will always arrive at your destination with your paddling partner at exactly the same time *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On Sep 21, 2009, at 10:32 AM, John Fereira wrote: > James wrote: >> I don't share the general prejudice against double kayaks. I >> certainly >> enjoy being captan of my own ship, but I think doubles add a >> wonderful >> dimension to the sport. > I've seen a list like this before. You can also add... > > When paddling a tandem it doesn't matter if one paddler is much > stronger than the other; you will always arrive at your destination > with your paddling partner at exactly the same time I put a Pacific Action sail on our tandem. I promise my wife she wont have to paddle much. If I choose my day on the water carefully I can keep my promise. Jim et al *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
"James" wrote: >>>>>>Doubles can be sociable, if you know how to get along with your partner. (But it is really hard for the stern paddler to hear the bow paddler most of the time.)<<<<<< and a lot more I agree with what James wrote but would like to add a couple of points. It is also very hard for the bow paddler to hear the stern paddler as the bow paddler's ears are facing the wrong way. To the stern paddler it seems that the bow paddler should have heard them (because they are so close together) but are just completely ignoring what was said. The stern paddler gets very frustrated because they don't realize the bow paddler just didn't hear them or has misinterpreted what was said. My major grip against double kayaks is that when going into the wind the stern paddler gets a face full of water with every second stroke. After pissing off the bow paddler (who thought I was criticizing her stroke) by trying to see if there was a stroke she was comfortable doing that wouldn't throw water into my face I put on my sou'wester and practiced the "stroke, stroke, duck" technique. If I had to paddle a double on a long trip again I think I'd carry a canoe paddle for the bow paddler to use whenever going upwind. Someone else already mentioned this, but the main reasons tour groups use doubles are that they cut the number of boats they need to keep together in half and they can change the crews around by putting weaker paddlers with stronger paddlers so they can eliminate the stragglers (and rabbits). That also makes it easier to keep the group together. All considered, I'd rather paddle a single and sometimes have to tow another single than have to paddle in a double all the time. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
MATT MARINER BROZE wrote: My major gripe against double kayaks is that when going into the wind the stern paddler gets a face full of water with every second stroke. I am unusual, I guess, in that I prefer to paddle in the bow of a tandem. I like having my feet firmly planted and the mushy footbraces that are also rudder controls bother me. A narrower boat in front of me is nice as well. On many longer trips I have had the opportunity to paddle into a headwind and still keep the stern paddler reasonably dry. I just use what forty years ago was called the "Scandinavian" or "sway-impulse" stroke. It would look familiar to any Traditional paddler because it is a forward stroke with a very low reach angle. Works just fine for me and keeps the spray to a minimum. The hallmarks of this stroke for sprint racers was keeping both hands right on the deck all through the stroke, ending the stroke with both hands in the water on the same side of the boat and providing power through what we now call torso rotation. Having a high seat really helped. I used something like this stroke for my sprint racing career and I had a seat that was only an inch lower than the deck of the kayak. I could put a lot of weight onto the stroke but couldn't stay upright very well when sitting still. I would tip over if I so much as sneezed. Anyway, a lazy, low-angle stroke might do the trick. Jim Tibensky *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
While we're at it, how about "In Praise of Quads." When it comes to teaching the nuances of a forward stroke, there's nothing like a quad. Put a technician in seat one, a trainee in seat two, an intermediate paddler in seat three, and a paddler with good balance and a decent low brace in seat four. That way the boat will move along at a near normal pace, while the trainee can mimic the technician's stroke without having to worry too much about balance. Then it's just a matter of time until the trainee can move to seat three, and another trainee can take seat two. Although not as sexy as singles, quads also work wonderfully when experienced paddlers want to learn and compare each other's techniques. It's a great way of spreading good technique throughout a club. (And apart from technique, quads are a blast for taking out kids and dogs.) *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
I haven't been a big fan of doubles since I spent a couple of years with one while married to my first wife (I wish I could remember her name) more than 35 years ago. Her idea of brisk paddling was to occasionally dab the tip of the paddle into the water if I started to sound cranky. In 1972 we took that boat around the Bowron Lakes; portages with that boat (and her) became a torture test of the highest magnitude. By 1974 both she and the double were gone; replaced (both of them) by a Grumman 15-foot "light" aluminum canoe. I say "light" because Grumman, back in those days, did produce a very lightweight version of their 15-foot canoe. That light weight aluminum canoe was useful both as a double and as a single. It would carry quite a load yet be relatively easy to paddle. It carried me, my dog, my gear and eventually my wife (Sue) and our kids on lakes, ponds, rivers and even salt water now and then. Someone stole it from our front yard (facing a lake north of Everett, WA) and by then Grumman no longer offered the lightweight version; but we got another 15-footer anyway. There is a paddler in B.C. who posts on the West Coast Paddler site who undertakes (hmm.... perhaps the wrong word choice... oh, well) expeditions in a double canoe. Occasionally being let off the ferry in mid-channel and picked up by the same ferry mid-channel (but another channel) a week or two later. His trip reports (look for "Monster") are wonderful to read and his photos are beautiful. Sue and I can paddle a canoe pretty quickly without much spray off the paddles only changing sides when we get tired of whatever side we've been paddling on. The stern paddle makes a fine rudder; a technique most canoists don't seem to have grasped. The canoe tradition runs culturally deep in my family (my wife and kids are members of the Chinook tribe) and all along the northwest coast of North America. And it's a wonderful cultural tradition across Canada and the northern USA. World wide, in fact; I've paddled native canoes in Brazil on the Amazon and the Rio Negro rivers (where you traditionally paddle from the front). Loaded properly and paddled skillfully you can take a canoe anywhere you can take a kayak and carry a lot more gear, too. So I'd like to add my words of praise for a well-designed canoe. Craig Jungers Moses Lake, WA *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
James wrote: >Doubles can be sociable, if you know how to get along with your >partner. But it is really hard for the stern paddler to hear the bow paddler >most of the time. G'Day, Doubles can be fast and sociable but I've paddled in the rear of a double where the distance between paddlers wasn't great enough to allow me to make a decent catch for the forward stroke. This wasn't too much of a problem for short trips but on a long session (>60km) the enforced poor technique resulted in a disabled shoulder that didn't cure for several weeks. Regarding communication in a double and in counterpoint to Craig's post; I was once paddling on the Hudson with the New York Downtown Boathouse group (wonderful group of people). A lasting image was of a couple, a woman in the front paddling strong and powerful and the man in the back relaxed, smoking a cigarette and with a huge grin on his face. It wasn't at all clear that the woman knew what was going on! All the best, PeterO *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In our Klepper XXL we have the possibility of changing the positions of the seats a lot. We began with me, the heavy one, sitting in the rear, with the wife up front, to finally end up with me in the center and the wife in the rear, which to us worked like a charm. Now we can pass things back and forth, and better hear what the other is saying - when sitting at the ends of the boat you had to yell if there was any wind, or sea, noise, to make yourself understood. Frustrating! Some sort of Bluetooth intercom would still help, but we try to keep it simple. We also found it easier to synchronize our paddling when sitting close, than when sitting further apart. Tord Lovely day here - rained all night, and now almost all clouds gone :-)! Two nights ago we had the first frost for the season! -- An Excellent Credit Score is 750 See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps! *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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