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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 17:58:38 -0700
A couple of wees ago Pam and I met up at the Port Gamble kayak symposium...
or show... or whatever it's called (it combined kayaks and bicycles which I
thought was creative). Port Gamble is a small classic Puget Sound seaport
town just beyond (north of) the Hood Canal Floating Bridge north of
Bremerton and south of Port Townsend. It's "beach" is nowhere near as nice
as the one at Port Townsend but the price was apparently right and I thought
that there was hope for the venue.

Since Pam has recently bought an Illusion which was designed by Sterling
Donalson we more or less hung out there and watched the proceedings from a
shady spot. Quite a few Puget Sound kayaking personalities paddle Sterling's
kayaks (including Dubside) and just sitting around listening to him explain
his designs to potential customers is a good education all by itself. One
thing he said caught my attention. He mentioned to someone that big guys are
reluctant to edge and that to overcome this he had designed a new version of
the Illusion (the Grand Illusion) for big guys with some attention to the
fact that we (ahem!) don't much like edging.

I edge my kayaks pretty aggressively but I must also admit to a certain
trepidation to really laying it up on edge. I wonder whether that has
something to do with my size or whether it has something to do with the size
of the boats I paddle. Most of the boats I have paddled and/or owned are not
boats designed for "big" people but since I spent a number of years in the
white water side of the sport I preferred the smaller, tighter feel of the
standard designs. Yet I do have two boats clearly built for the larger guy:
a Nimbus Telkwa HV and an SOF F-1 that Brian Schulz designed for a bigger
paddler.

Since I generally prefer to paddle a boat designed for someone smaller than
I am (I loved my Coaster, after all) perhaps my own feelings towards really
getting my boats on an edge stem from the fact that the boats just don't
work as well with a big guy in the cockpit. Yet even the F-1 is, I feel,
more difficult to get right up on edge. And the Nimbus is, as well.

It makes sense that a lower displacement kayak will be narrow and a narrow
boat will be easier to edge. I remember the flash of insight I had when I
discovered that to a lot of paddlers the word "performance" meant how fast
it was from edge to edge; I had always equated "performance" with precise
and quick steering and movement. For me a shorter kayak with some rocker but
a hull designed to also track when not on edge was perfect. For someone else
a longer, more narrow hull was more important.

I may be wandering a bit here but bear with me. My basic questions are:

A) Do other "big" paddlers also have an aversion to really getting their
kayaks on edge?
B) Have they chosen a kayak based on that?
C) Can a boat designed to "fit" a larger paddler be as quick and nimble as
one designed for a smaller paddler?
D) All else being equal is it possible to simply scale a design up or down
to fit a larger or smaller paddler while retaining the characteristics that
made the boat "good" at its original size?
E) Can a big guy ever hope to get a boat with the same performance
characteristics as an "average" (smaller) paddler can get or does "mass"
play an important role here?

Sterling obviously felt that he needed to redesign the Illusion to fit
himself; the standard Illusion already has a way of scaling at least th
cockpit size up or down within a range of paddler sizes and preferences.
That wasn't, apparently, sufficient for Sterling; hence the "Grand
Illusion". Matt and Cam Broze produced several versions of kayaks (the two
sizes of the Express and the Elan come to mind) that seemed to fill a niche.
All of those boats are still in high demand on the used market.

It seems to me that if you weigh somewhere around 150 to 170 pounds you have
a much better chance of getting excellent performance out of a kayak design
than if you weight 240 to 300 pounds (or 100 pounds). Is there any basis for
this?


Craig Jungers
Moses lake, WA
www.nwkayaking.net
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From: Dave Kruger <kdruger_at_pacifier.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 18:21:02 -0700
Craig Jungers wrote:

> It seems to me that if you weigh somewhere around 150 to 170 pounds you have
> a much better chance of getting excellent performance out of a kayak design
> than if you weight 240 to 300 pounds [edit]. Is there any basis for
> this?

Given what is on the market for big guys, probably so.

Put the *average* big guy in one tailored as the larger Illusion is for a 
larger guy, probably not.  Reason?  Bigger guys tend to be less flexible 
and not as fit (Am There; Am That).

On the other hand, a larger guy who is both *fit and flexible* should be 
able to do as well in a boat tailored for his body mass as a smaller, 
equally fit guy would do in what the market currently provides.

to wit:  put LeBron James in one of those larger Illusions, and I bet he 
could do what Dubside does, after getting his moves down.  Me, not so much, 
not so much, not so much, not ever!

A bottom line for larger, average, guys might be:  train *first* so as to 
get your percent body mass as fat down to something reasonable, and *then* 
try out an Illusion to see if it is a good investment.

The boat will never make the man (or, woman).

-- 
Dave Kruger
Astoria, OR
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From: MATT MARINER BROZE <marinerkayaks_at_msn.com>
subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 20:13:04 -0700
Craig asked:



A) Do other "big" paddlers also have an aversion to really getting their
kayaks on edge?



Most folks have an aversion to really getting their kayak on edge. This is
because once you have leaned the kayak beyond the point of maximum righting
moment any further leaning momentum will result in a nearly instant capsize as
the righting force will decrease quicker than you can stop your momentum
(unless, of course, a solid brace is in place). Kayaks vary on how far over
they can be tipped before this point is reached. This also varies by how much
weight the paddler has above the center of gravity that they are shifting
while leaning the kayak. Given the same hull, and if they want to avoid a
capsize, the heavier paddler (and the more weight they have higher
up--typically males) the less thay can lean that particular kayak without
being dependent entirely on their bracing ability, their strength/weight ratio
and their attention to where the kayak/paddler's capsize point is.





B) Have they chosen a kayak based on that?



Most likely they chose their kayak based more on the feelings of security
(more based on initial stability) since a bigger taller person has a higher
center of gravity and more weight that is shifting making a kayak that a
smaller paddler would feel very stable in, feel quite tippy for them.


C) Can a boat designed to "fit" a larger paddler be as quick and nimble as one
designed for a smaller paddler?


No, on average most bigger folks aren't as nimble as smaller folk. They have
more mass to accellerate. However, relative to other paddlers of their weight,
the kayak they choose will limit how nimble they can be.



D) All else being equal is it possible to simply scale a design up or down to
fit a larger or smaller paddler while retaining the characteristics that made
the boat "good" at its original size?



Yes, but you have to scale all the dimensions, not just make the kayak longer,
wider, or deeper (just one dimension) so the paddler can physically fit the
kayak. The Illusion came in many depths but most middle to larger paddlers
feel it is pretty tippy (see latest Sea Kayaker review). Making it deeper
might mean a bigger paddler could physically fit in it but it would need to be
wider to have the same feeling of stability and likely longer or fuller in the
ends to have it sit in the water the same (as a smaller kayak does for a
lighter paddler). Sterling recognizes this (and is a huge guy himself) and
that is why he is developing the Grand Illusion.


E) Can a big guy ever hope to get a boat with the same performance
characteristics as an "average" (smaller) paddler can get or does "mass" play
an important role here?


Wider and longer mean more wetted surface and more friction but typically the
bigger paddler is stronger and is therfore more likely to be able to deal with
the extra wetted surface and windage that his bigger kayak will have. The
smaller paddler gets blown around easier and needs to be careful to get a
smaller (in all dimensions kayak) so as to maximize the advantages of less
wetted surface and less windage and lever arm for the windage to act on. A big
paddler in too small a kayak also may have a rescueability problem in that
that kayak might not support his weight when swamped. The small paddler has a
problem with too wide a kayak because it takes too much effort to lean it on
edge and they must lean their body way out into a much more vulnerable
position to get the kayak to lean much. Because they have had to force the
kayak up on edge (and had to lift their body more against gravity to do it) it
is easier to go too far. The smaller paddler will have a problem with too long
a kayak because of windage and the lever arm the wind has and the extra wetted
surface will likely mean they won't be able to take advantage of the higher
potential hull speed anyway but at the same time will have had to work against
more friction all the time they paddle it. Both the longer and deeper kayak
will increase the windage the smaller paddler will have to arm wrestle against
(no advantage to a better strength to weight ratio a smaller paddler may have
here--like they would with gravity). The deeper kayak will likely fit the
smaller kayak so that they feel they are having to paddle out over the sides
of a bathtub because they have to hold their paddle so high. Because their
hands are lower to start with they will have to stroke further off center with
a wider kayak (as well as find it too much work to lean the wider kayak to
increase turning speed).



Craig also wrote:

"It seems to me that if you weigh somewhere around 150 to 170 pounds you have
a much better chance of getting excellent performance out of a kayak design
than if you weight 240 to 300 pounds (or 100 pounds). Is there any basis for
this?"

As a big paddler you will get way better performance out of your Nimbus Telkwa
HV than a lot smaller paddlers will. It is kayak dependant, not a general
rule. Of course, those in the middle of the bell-curve always have more
choices in the market than those at the extremes. Most manufacturers are going
to concentrate their energy (especially initially) towards the largest
markets. As there became more customers for sea kayaks, sea kayak designers
found they could also profitably make kayaks for market niches and so some do.
Our Sprite model was designed for smaller paddlers, but it wasn't as small as
some smaller paddlers actually needed. The Coaster was designed for playing in
ocean surf (and fitting us more like a WW kayak) but at least half of those
sold because they fit the niche for small paddlers (even though
unintentionally). The Elan was derived from the Express but it was made
narrower and more V-bottomed (as well as much lower and with the cockpit
lowered even more by recessing it into the deck) so it wouldn't be too stable
to easily lean with a gear load or sit too high in the water for smaller
paddlers (who wanted a longer, narrower, kayak than the Coaster). The windage
was also substantially reduced from the Express even though the lengths are
about the same, again to make it easier for a smaller, lighter, less strong
paddler to turn it into a higher wind when it was unladen (when these things
matter most). Cam and I can't even fit into the Elan comfortably because our
thighs are too deep and our feet are too big, but then it wasn't designed for
folks our size.



So my conclusion is, the world isn't picking on you Craig. Even if it
sometimes feels to you like it is.









Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 17:59:56 -0700
Subject: Fwd: Boat and People sizes
From: crjungers_at_gmail.com
To: marinerkayaks_at_msn.com

Since you may not get this - or any replies - in a timely manner I thought I'd
send this to you separately. :)

Craig
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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2010 20:34:34 -0700
On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 8:13 PM, MATT MARINER BROZE
<marinerkayaks_at_msn.com>wrote:

>
>
> So my conclusion is, the world isn't picking on you Craig. Even if it
> sometimes feels to you like it is.
>

A Likely Story!  :P

Craig
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From: Darryl Johnson <darryl_johnson_at_rogers.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sat, 03 Jul 2010 09:29:45 -0400
  To tag on to Craig's post, I have a friend who is trying to find a 
boat. He is, in one sense of the word, a "big" guy. But he's big 
across his .. uh .. derrihre, his stomach and he has large thighs. I'd 
guess he's about 250-275 pounds. He's only about 5'10" or 5'11", so 
boats that he can fit in, like the Seaward Navigator, or just too high 
and/or long to be able to get his knees locked in.

There seem to be boats out there for the tall people, and boats for us 
svelte types (ignoring what I see in the mirror in the mornings!), but 
not much for the the medium height, 'stocky' builds.

The Nimbus Telkwa made him happier than his current Navigator, but 
even that gives him issues trying to get his knees locked in to the 
thigh braces in bumpy water.

Anyone care to offer any suggestions of boats that his body type might 
be better suited to?

-- 
   Darryl
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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sat, 3 Jul 2010 07:07:50 -0700
On Sat, Jul 3, 2010 at 6:29 AM, Darryl Johnson <darryl_johnson_at_rogers.com>wrote:

>
> There seem to be boats out there for the tall people, and boats for us
> svelte types (ignoring what I see in the mirror in the mornings!), but not
> much for the the medium height, 'stocky' builds.
>
> Okay... I'll take a shot at this. The "Illusion" by Sterling's Kayaks (
www.sterlingskayak.com) was mentioned in my original post on this thread and
it is well worth looking at. Sterling has created a novel cockpit simulator
where a potential paddler can see if any combination of volume will suit
his/her body type. This is not a measure of how the kayak will paddle, mind
you, but simply a way to determine which version of boat will fit your body
type best. Once that's dialed in you can try a boat that's close and see how
you like the way it performs.

Failing that, there is always the SOF route. Brian Schulz, who created the
F-1 in SOF from his virtually identical copies of the Mariner Coaster in
SOF, is very good at creating a boat that fits the customer. You don't
actually *have* to build it yourself as Brian can build the boat from your
measurements (for a sum of money over and above the class "kit" version).
When I took his course one of our class members was building what amounted
to a Mariner Express in SOF but designed around his own body measurements.
He seemed very happy with the finished product, too.

It's no secret that I like my F-1 a lot but I've been a long-time fan of
Mariner kayaks anyway. Many of my ideas about SOF kayaks were completely
blown away by the F-1 but the biggest one was that it would feel like a
folding boat. In stark contrast, my F-1 feels solid and stable in the water.
I suppose it must be flexing somewhat but I certainly don't feel it.

So there are two ideas.


Craig Jungers
Moses Lake, WA
www.nwkayaking.net
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From: Mark Sanders <marksanders_at_sandmarks.net>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sat, 03 Jul 2010 10:59:07 -0700
The QCC 500 might do. I think they have one of the smallest cockpit 
lengths for a large man boat at 30" long.
He may just have to get creative with minicel foam!

Mark

On 7/3/2010 6:29 AM, Darryl Johnson wrote:
>  To tag on to Craig's post, I have a friend who is trying to find a 
> boat. He is, in one sense of the word, a "big" guy. But he's big 
> across his .. uh .. derrihre, his stomach and he has large thighs. I'd 
> guess he's about 250-275 pounds. He's only about 5'10" or 5'11", so 
> boats that he can fit in, like the Seaward Navigator, or just too high 
> and/or long to be able to get his knees locked in.
>
> There seem to be boats out there for the tall people, and boats for us 
> svelte types (ignoring what I see in the mirror in the mornings!), but 
> not much for the the medium height, 'stocky' builds.
>
> The Nimbus Telkwa made him happier than his current Navigator, but 
> even that gives him issues trying to get his knees locked in to the 
> thigh braces in bumpy water.
>
> Anyone care to offer any suggestions of boats that his body type might 
> be better suited to?
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From: Craig Jungers <crjungers_at_gmail.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Sat, 3 Jul 2010 11:29:28 -0700
On Sat, Jul 3, 2010 at 10:59 AM, Mark Sanders <marksanders_at_sandmarks.net>wrote:

> The QCC 500 might do. I think they have one of the smallest cockpit lengths
> for a large man boat at 30" long.
>

For me a short cockpit is anathema but that might be just the thing for
Darryl's friend. It could put his knees in the perfect place without needing
18" of foam.


> He may just have to get creative with minicel foam!
>

You can only go so far with that but it might be his last resort. I'm not a
big fan of lots of foam fitting. I prefer the minimum for comfort and then
pulling the foot pegs closer to keep my knees in contact with the deck. If
you have short legs but need a wider cockpit and seat the corresponding high
deck most manufacturers provide makes that difficult.

QCC's support is also fantastic; just ask Mark. (grin)

I would also take the kayak paddler-weight numbers with a grain of salt. As
an example, in white water kayaks the RPM Max is recommended for "larger"
paddlers (I paddle one and I think Mark still has his) and has a volume of
90 gallons. Most "sea" kayaks would list a 90-gallon boat for average to
smaller paddlers. 90 gallons is also the volume of the Mariner Coaster, just
fyi.

A lot depends on what he wants to do, too. The Telkwa wouldn't be my choice
for surfing but it is a fantastic boat if you like to do trips. Plus, for
bigger paddlers, the Telkwa performs pretty well even as a day boat.


Craig Jungers
Moses Lake, WA
www.nwkayaking.net
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From: <jvolin_at_optonline.net>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 16:17:38 +0000
I don't know if Necky still males the Kyook but that would probably work for him.  Of they don't make it any more, perhaps a used one might be available.
Joan
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: Darryl Johnson <darryl_johnson_at_rogers.com>
Sender: owner-paddlewise_at_paddlewise.net
Date: Sat, 03 Jul 2010 09:29:45 
Cc: Paddlewise Paddlewise<paddlewise_at_paddlewise.net>
Subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes

  To tag on to Craig's post, I have a friend who is trying to find a 
boat. He is, in one sense of the word, a "big" guy. But he's big 
across his .. uh .. derrihre, his stomach and he has large thighs. I'd 
guess he's about 250-275 pounds. He's only about 5'10" or 5'11", so 
boats that he can fit in, like the Seaward Navigator, or just too high 
and/or long to be able to get his knees locked in.

There seem to be boats out there for the tall people, and boats for us 
svelte types (ignoring what I see in the mirror in the mornings!), but 
not much for the the medium height, 'stocky' builds.

The Nimbus Telkwa made him happier than his current Navigator, but 
even that gives him issues trying to get his knees locked in to the 
thigh braces in bumpy water.

Anyone care to offer any suggestions of boats that his body type might 
be better suited to?

-- 
   Darryl
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From: MATT MARINER BROZE <marinerkayaks_at_msn.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 14:55:32 -0700
Darryl asked:



>>>>>....I have a friend who is trying to find a
boat. He is, in one sense of the word, a "big" guy. But he's big
across his .. uh .. derrihre, his stomach and he has large thighs. I'd
guess he's about 250-275 pounds. He's only about 5'10" or 5'11", so
boats that he can fit in, like the Seaward Navigator, or just too high
and/or long to be able to get his knees locked in.
.....
The Nimbus Telkwa made him happier than his current Navigator, but
even that gives him issues trying to get his knees locked in to the
thigh braces in bumpy water.

Anyone care to offer any suggestions of boats that his body type might
be better suited to?<<<<<<


The Nimbus Telkwa Sport has a slightly shorter cockpit than the Telkwa but it
is only 1/4" narrower (and recessed down more to fit shorter paddlers better).
I can highly recommend the Telkwa's for bigger paddlers.  If it is not too low
to fit his thighs that might be his best choice. The older Nimbus Seafarer
from the 1980's fit bigger guys. Several Necky Kayaks fit bigger guys.
Probably because Mike Neckar himself didn't, shall we say, fit the physical
profile of most other world class athletes.



Besides the Kyook (first introduced in 1991--Necky's first plastic kayak),
there are the Nootka (1986) and its update a few years later called the
Tesla). In 1998 the Tesla NM came out and it was widened to 25" and made
especially to better fit bigger guys. In 1997 the Necky Pinta came out for the
truly huge paddlers. I suspect it will be too big and wide (27") for your
friend though. Another plastic Necky that may be suitable is the Eskia that
came out in 2001. Pacific Water Sports made the Thunderbird in 1991 for truly
huge guys but a year later made a cut down version called the Thunderbird LP
for shorter big paddlers. Still at 28.25" wide it is a pretty wide kayak for
someone your friend's size. I talked to someone who wanted to buy another
Thunderbird (because he liked the high stability for kayak sailing) and when I
asked Lee Moyer about it he told me (a year or two ago) that they can still be
made.



Sometimes a kayak with a wide enough cockpit doesn't have a big enough seat.
It is usually relatively easy to remove the original seat and replace it with
some foam seat or seat pad.



Wayne ?somebody? used to post a list of big guys kayaks he fit in on the
internet. I think he was also on Paddlewise back in the 1990's. I looked to
see if I had made a copy of his webpage before he closed it but couldn't find
one. I once had a list of big guy boats (and also small person kayaks) posted
in the back of my shop in order to help folks who's size made the kayak
selection available to fit them rather small. I looked for it in my computer
files but only found what I had written to someone on Paddlewise in 2000 (see
edited version below). I'm sure others have come out in the last ten years as
well.



....At your size some kayaks that I am pretty sure you will fit into and that
probably will be stable enough are (in roughly alphabetical order):

Current Designs Pachena
Current Designs Breeze (plastic Pachena)
Current Designs Solstice GTHV
Easy Rider Seahawk
Easy Rider Eskimo 17 (or 18-6)
Eddyline Wind Dancer
Necky Pinta
Necky Tesla NM
Nimbus Seafarer
Nimbus Telkwa (or Telkwa HV)
Northwest Kayaks Pursuit XL
PWS Sea Otter 500 GP (or Expedition)
PWS Thunderbird
Seda Viking
Wilkinson Boat Enetai HP
Wilkinson Boat Polaris II
Wilderness Systems Sealution XL

I'm not recommending all these, some of them I really detest, but these should
all fit you and be stable enough (at least once you become relatively
skilled). Novice paddlers tend to overate stability and tracking stiffness to
their detriment later but there does need to be a certain minimum stability or
you will never get comfortable with it. Be careful of a smaller paddlers
experiences or judgment concerning what is a good kayak here.......
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From: Dave Kruger <kdruger_at_pacifier.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Mon, 05 Jul 2010 16:38:26 -0700
MATT MARINER BROZE wrote:
> Darryl asked:
> 
> 
> 
> ....I have a friend who is trying to find a boat. He is, in one sense of
> the word, a "big" guy. But he's big across his .. uh .. derrihre, his
> stomach and he has large thighs. I'd guess he's about 250-275 pounds.
> He's only about 5'10" or 5'11", so boats that he can fit in, like the
> Seaward Navigator, or just too high and/or long to be able to get his
> knees locked in.

Coming in late to this, Darryl, but your big guy may find that a little 
creative outfitting/redesign of the seat will enable him to enjoy a wider 
range of boats.  For example, the Eddyline seats of an older vintage 
(pre-1998 or so) are best removed and replaced with minicell custom 
versions, or maybe a Redfish kayaks custom seat, both for comfort, fit, and 
to lower the derrihre an inch or two, which allows the thighs to fit under 
the deck and/or thigh hooks for a good tight embrace.

My Eddyline Wind Dance, perhaps the prototypical example of a "high volume" 
  boat in the nineteen eighties and into the nineties would not fit him, 
despite its presence on Matt's list, for that reason.

He may not want to cut and carve on a new boat, but an older Wind Dancer 
(or similar), if he can find one, might be a cost effective way to get into 
the game, and with the assistance of a person handy with tools, he can make 
the boat fit him.  Links to help him out: 
http://www.redfishkayak.com/seats.htm  http://www.kayakfit.com/

Sympathetic anecdote:  Matt probably does nor recall this, but I stumbled 
into his shop back in the summer of 1992 and asked about his boats, my 
first venture into this game.  He quickly (and mercifully) passed me on to 
NWOC next door, where they had boats more my style.  On the NWOC float, 
twenty minutes later, I had shoehorned my 220 lbs into a boat that on paper 
was just right for me, and while struggling to get back out (this is on the 
float, mind you, *not* in the water!), I asked the Gen-X attendant what was 
wrong.  He sized me up (after extraction) for a couple seconds, blinked 
twice, and said, "Ohhhh!  You need a *high volume* boat!"  I stepped into a 
Wind Dancer and that was it for me.  I'm on my second one, and it is a pig 
to paddle in the wind, but is a ginormous cargo hauler, sometimes labeled 
"the slowest boat I've ever paddled" by folks I loan it to.

Works for me.  And, your buddy, Darryl, can always use my throwaway line 
when people harass him subtly or not about his "shape:"  "Oh, yeah, I'm a 
big guy in the cockpit area!"  Heads always turn when I toss that out. 
Some of them even turn my way ... [wink]

-- 
Dave Kruger
Astoria, OR
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From: MATT MARINER BROZE <marinerkayaks_at_msn.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 16:03:56 -0700
Some other kayaks that may fit a wide but not especially tall paddler are:



Boreal Design Nanook

Current Designs Isle

Current Designs Kestral 160

Some of the wider cockpit Delta kayaks models

Eddyline Nighthawk

Formula Kayaks (Impex) Serenity or lower Serenity Sport

Natural Designs Polaris II (may still be available new from Wilkinson Boat)

Sedas Viking Max (a newer Viking with, among other things, a bigger cockpit)

Wilderness Systems Tsunami 175
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From: Moses Fridlich <mofrid_at_optonline.net>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 15:54:36 -0400
> Anyone care to offer any suggestions of boats that his body type might
> be better suited to?
>
>
Know a couple of stocky people including myself that love the Necky Tesla.
High volume boat that is a treasure if you do a lot of kayak camping.

Regards,
Mo
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From: <MJKory_at_aol.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Mon, 5 Jul 2010 20:28:13 EDT
Don't know if this was already mentioned, but another good boat for a big  
guy is the Necky Tesla. 
 
 
In a message dated 7/5/2010 4:04:47 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,  
marinerkayaks_at_msn.com writes:

Some  other kayaks that may fit a wide but not especially tall paddler  are:

Boreal Design Nanook
Current Designs  Isle
Current Designs Kestral 160
Some of the wider cockpit Delta  kayaks models
Eddyline Nighthawk
Formula Kayaks (Impex) Serenity  or lower Serenity Sport
Natural Designs Polaris II (may still be  available new from Wilkinson Boat)
Sedas Viking Max (a newer Viking  with, among other things, a bigger cockpit)
Wilderness Systems Tsunami  175
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From: Tord <tord_at_mindless.com>
subject: Re: [Paddlewise] Boat and People sizes
Date: Tue, 06 Jul 2010 16:53:01 -0400
A truly huge friend of mine loves his Nordkapp, the original version (he's
over 2 meters tall
and strong as an ox, little or no fat).

Others seem to like the single-seat Klepper Aerius, while others modify their
Aerius II to
single person use :-)!

Tord

PS My wife has found a new water-proof camera with excellent optics: The Sony
DSC-TX5.
It takes amazing macros, and has a fairly long zoom. Over and out!
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