The peer reviewed medical literature on hydration supports the use of plain water for maintaining hydration and rehydration. With that, if the use of sports drinks works for you, do it. I like the hydration system approach because I find I take lots of small sips and take in more water with a hose than with a water bottle. Dana > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Champoux [mailto:jim_at_sigall.com] > Sent: Friday, April 30, 1999 9:23 AM > To: Dickson, Dana A.; Paddle~Wise > Subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Hydration systems > Importance: Low > > > Dana wrote..... > > >Bob, Its hard to argue with personal experience for what > makes you feel > >better when you paddle. I have tried various electrolyte > drinks and found > >for me that they don't work any better than plain water. > > I was reading an article in some magazine about > sports/electrolyte drinks > and while they were proven to work minimally better than > water (absorbtion, > content) the bottom line was this; mix 16 oz of apple juice > with 16 oz of > water add 1/3 tsp of salt and youve got your own. > > *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Maybe those peers were in Minnesota and not Florida! cya The peer reviewed medical literature on hydration supports the use of plain water for maintaining hydration and rehydration. With that, if the use of sports drinks works for you, do it. I like the hydration system approach because I find I take lots of small sips and take in more water with a hose than with a water bottle. Dana > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Champoux [mailto:jim_at_sigall.com] > Sent: Friday, April 30, 1999 9:23 AM > To: Dickson, Dana A.; Paddle~Wise > Subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Hydration systems > Importance: Low > > > Dana wrote..... > > >Bob, Its hard to argue with personal experience for what > makes you feel > >better when you paddle. I have tried various electrolyte > drinks and found > >for me that they don't work any better than plain water. > > I was reading an article in some magazine about > sports/electrolyte drinks > and while they were proven to work minimally better than > water (absorbtion, > content) the bottom line was this; mix 16 oz of apple juice > with 16 oz of > water add 1/3 tsp of salt and youve got your own. > > *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
Peer review by "Doctors" on a nutrition issue? Aren't you aware that medical doctors receive only one nutrition course in med school, and are in fact, the LAST group you would go to for nutritional advice. If you check with any elite level cyclists or triathletes ( athletes that engage in an aerobic sport for many hours at a time) they will tell you without question, that water is OK for an hour, but for longer efforts, your body loses too much glycogen and electrolyte. The effects are too obvious to challenge. In an 80 mile bike race, a racer on water COULD NOT COMPETE with one on a product like Twin Lab's Hydra Fuel, or Champion Nutrition's Cytomax, or other high tech equivalent. Gatorade is considered total garbage by any elite level cyclist or triathlete---its far to hypertonic, so it actually draws water OUT of your cells, unless you dilute it 50/50, and even then, it derives it carb from a dextrose type sugar, meaning you will get an insulin spike on drinking it, and use far too much oxygen up digesting and metabolizing it. Kayakers will benefit from smoother energy levels and much longer endurance, if they continue hydration every 10 minutes or so with a product like Hydra Fuel or Cytomax. Regards, Dan Volker -----Original Message----- From: owner-paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net [mailto:owner-paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net]On Behalf Of Bob Denton Sent: Friday, April 30, 1999 10:43 AM To: Dickson, Dana A.; 'Jim Champoux'; Paddle~Wise Cc: Bob Denton Subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Hydration systems/electrolytes Maybe those peers were in Minnesota and not Florida! cya The peer reviewed medical literature on hydration supports the use of plain water for maintaining hydration and rehydration. With that, if the use of sports drinks works for you, do it. I like the hydration system approach because I find I take lots of small sips and take in more water with a hose than with a water bottle. Dana > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Champoux [mailto:jim_at_sigall.com] > Sent: Friday, April 30, 1999 9:23 AM > To: Dickson, Dana A.; Paddle~Wise > Subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Hydration systems > Importance: Low > > > Dana wrote..... > > >Bob, Its hard to argue with personal experience for what > makes you feel > >better when you paddle. I have tried various electrolyte > drinks and found > >for me that they don't work any better than plain water. > > I was reading an article in some magazine about > sports/electrolyte drinks > and while they were proven to work minimally better than > water (absorbtion, > content) the bottom line was this; mix 16 oz of apple juice > with 16 oz of > water add 1/3 tsp of salt and youve got your own. > > *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ *************************************************************************** *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
On Apr 30, 12:28, "Dan Volker" wrote: } Subject: RE: [Paddlewise] Hydration systems/electrolytes > > If you check with any elite level cyclists or triathletes ( athletes that > engage in an aerobic sport for many hours at a time) they will tell you > without question, that water is OK for an hour, but for longer efforts, your > body loses too much glycogen and electrolyte. Except that elite level cyclists and triathletes are expending much more energy and sweating a lot more than almost all kayakers, expending glycogen and losing electrolytes at a much faster rate. That "hour" doesn't apply to us, by and large. An article in the California Kayak Friends newsletter, at http://www.ckf.org/yak/December95.txt: -------------------------------------------------------------- SOME THOUGHTS ON NEEDING TO BE RESCUED WHY IT HAPPENS AND WHAT TO DO TO PREVENT IT by: STEPHEN A. WILLIAMS, RN, MEd PROGRAM DIRECTOR, EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES MT. SAN ANTONIO COLLEGE 1100 NORTH GRAND AVENUE WALNUT, CA 91789 909-594-5611 Ext. 4657 Steve has over 20 years background in Mountain Rescue, Search & Rescue, Air Rescue. The first 10 years as a Paramedic, the last 10 years as an RN. He is the Program Director and a Primary Instructor in the Paramedic Program at Mt. San Antonio College, the top-ranked Paramedic Program in California. He is a regular at Southwind's Wednesday night social paddles and will be glad t o tackle any emergency medical problems you'd like to suggest. He is a member of the Wilderness Medical Society, an international group of outdoor-minded physicians and wilderness experts. Steve attends frequent wilderness medical seminars. PADDLING ENERGY - For energy paddling, you need sugar and water and oxygen - really, that's it. Because of something called the "Glycemic Index," complex carbohydrates (starches) are better for the long haul than simple carbohydrates (sugars). Some of the "Power Bar" type of stuff some athletes eat contain a lot of protein (or its building blocks - the aminoacids). Unless you can drink large quantities of water, you are better off eating carbohydrates than protein. While you are actively exercising you are not building up muscle, that happens after the exercise. You will not break down muscle if you have enough carbohydrates in your system while you exercise. Therefore, if you exercise for hours and eat proteins, your body goes through a complex process to convert that nice protein into energy to burn (basically turning the protein into sugar) - and the process produces more waste than eating carbohydrates. Your body can only store maybe 2 hours worth of carbohydrate energy, then if you have not been replacing it along the way, your body goes into catabolism - its tarts breaking down protein and fat for fuel. Now I can hear you saying, "Oh yeah!" - but you should know that the first target is the easier to burn protein, not the fat. That is why body builders trying to get huge eat from 6-8 small meals per day. WHAT FLUID SHOULD YOU DRINK? Gatorade? Plain water? There is a large misunderstanding in this area. It comes from not knowing how we sweat. When one does light to moderate exercise (kayaking or peddling a bike on level ground) in a cool to moderate climate (as we normally kayak in) then if you break out in a sweat , you are losing 5 mEq (milliequivalents) of salt in your sweat. If you exercise heavily (football linemen, construction workers) in a high heat environment (temperature and humidity) then your sweat contains 120 mEq of salt. That is why the former type of exercise never leaves salt rings on your clothing like the latter does! When the climate is comfortable and you exercise lightly, you can get away with water. But if you are pushing it on a hot, humid day, you will understand why they needed to invent that beverage if they were going to play football in Florida in the sun - (that's right, it was invented in place of lemonade for the Florida Gators in the Gator Bowl). By the way, the human is the only animal we know of that cannot rely on thirst to tell him when to drink. The average adult will have lost one to two pounds of water before becoming thirsty. Force fluids! Drink more than you think you need. WHAT CAUSES FATIGUE? A lot of things, but one important one is not delivering enough oxygen and fuel to muscles. If you sprint, you can easily experience the fade out of power when you can't deliver enough oxygen to your muscles as fast a s they burn it. Well, the same thing goes for fuel (carbohydrates). If the muscle runs out, fatigue sets in. But another big factor in fatigue is dehydration . As you sweat (or pee) you lose water. This results in your blood actually becoming thicker. It does not flow as fast, and will not supply fuel to your muscles as well. One of the signs of dehydration is having no appetite (and having a bad attitude). Ever "been there - done that?" How about a deck bag of grapes? If you are going to exercise for more than 15 minutes, you need to drink. If you are going to exercise for more than 2 hours, you need to replace fuel. You ca n drink it in a sport drink, killing the proverbial 2 birds, or you can bring along water and then have some sort of carbohydrate at hand to ibble on while paddling. Personally, I am not into endurance kayaking - (sorry, George, paddling to Anacapa is not in my future). But, on searches I have hiked from dawn to well into the night. Long distance hikers know the value of a good breakfast. Then, lunch is the meal that stretches from breakfast till dinner - and should be eaten in that manner, a little at a time - the same way it is burned - every hour of the day. Adequate hydration and adequate food intake will make your paddling seem nicer, and less like an ordeal - it will even improve your attitude. It will also keep you safer - when you need that burst of energy to get yourself out of trouble. The rule for hiking - never hike out farther than you want to (and are able to) hike back - probably applies to kayaking also. Except that in kayaking, add that the wind will turn and be blowing in your face on the way back. Don't ask me how the wind knows when to do that - it just does! Maybe it listens to the Laws of some guy named Murphy. HAPPY & SAFE PADDLING! MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU! -- Bob Myers InteleNet Communications, Inc. Email: bob_at_InteleNet.net 18101 Von Karman Avenue, Suite 550 Phone: 949-851-8250 x227 Irvine, CA 92612 Fax: 949-851-1088 http://www.intelenet.net/ *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
I'm certainly not an elite cyclist, but I did finish the Markleeville Death Ride last summer, 129 miles and 16,000 vertical feet of climbing in a day (at the age of 51), and I think I'm qualified to second Dan's comments. I think that where there may be some confusion is in the level of exercise or endurance. For an easy few hours of paddling, water may be fine, but for anything requiring real endurance, water won't work - you really need Cytomax or something equal. Bob *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List Submissions: paddlewise_at_lists.intelenet.net Subscriptions: paddlewise-request_at_lists.intelenet.net Website: http://www.gasp-seakayak.net/paddlewise/ ***************************************************************************
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