It's time to replace the old spray skirt with one that's new. Please let me know what your preferred skirt is. Here are the criteria that I care about. 1. Easy-on: I want a skirt that's easy to put on in rough conditions, and one that I can put on while wearing gloves. 2. Cold water use: I paddle in Long Island Sound off of Connecticut year round. Summers are hot and warm; winters are cold. 3. Leak-proof: I'd like to minimize water leaking in during rolls and skulling. 4. Nylon vs. Neoprene: I don't think that I care much, provided the above criteria are met. I appreciate your input. Bob Vilter *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
On Saturday, October 27, 2001, at 6:58:48 PM PDT, rvilter wrote: Hello Bob, You wrote: > Here are the criteria that I care about. > 1. Easy-on: I want a skirt that's easy to put on in rough > conditions, and one that I can put on while wearing gloves. I use a SnapDragon™ neoprene deck/nylon tunnel skirt, with an adjustable bungie. In cold conditions, I wear thick neo gloves, and I have no trouble putting my skirt on - in all sorts of conditions. > 2. Cold water use: I paddle in Long Island Sound off of Connecticut > year round. Summers are hot and warm; winters are cold. I use the same skirt year 'round. > 3. Leak-proof: I'd like to minimize water leaking in during rolls > and skulling. With the nylon tunnel (adjustable, with suspenders), I make sure it's tightly underneath my PFD. When I wear a dry top, I wear the dry top *over* the tunnel of the skirt - then the PFD. This keeps me very dry during rolls and crashing waves. > 4. Nylon vs. Neoprene: I don't think that I care much, provided the > above criteria are met. As I mentioned above - the deck of my skirt is neoprene, and the Tunnel is nylon - with an adjustable top and suspenders. I wouldn't really trust a nylon decked skirt in big surf. And for winter paddling, the neoprene is warmer. Melissa -- PGP public keys: mailto:pgp_keys_at_gmx.co.uk?subject=PGP_Keys_1&Body=Please%20send%20keys *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
From: "rvilter" <rvilter_at_optonline.net> > 1. Easy-on: I want a skirt that's easy to put on in rough conditions, and one that I can put on while wearing gloves. Of the skirts I own (or have used), I've found that the easiest to put on is the Boreal Designs skirt for my Ellesmere ocean cockpit. I am not recommending BD as a brand specifically*, but rather will point out the construction as something to look for. It's all neoprene. The skirt has a relatively stiff bungie sewn to the edge of the skirt. This makes it easy to put on. The bungie holds its shape much better than the skirts that have a softer bungie inside a hem (like the Brooks models). While the stiff rubber rand models like the Perception Harmony LC-1 also keep their shape, they tend to have less stretch and are harder to put on. Several companies make this style. There's one brand that makes most of their skirts this way and I can't for the life of me remember the name, though an image of the distinctive style and colour is in my head (Snapdragon?). Mike * Not that there's anything wrong with BD. They make a fine skirt. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi PaddleWisenheimers, Jackie has again done a wonderful thing: she put my rather short story about crossing the Baltic Sea/the Finnish Gulf to the PW web-site: http://www.paddlewise.net/photoalbum/photoalbum.html Enjoy the pictures, they were originally published with several stories in the local Finnish Paddling Magazine Meloja. Cheers, Ari (dull & gray Finland - the November gales are around here) *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Ari, I enjoyed your story and photos. It is especially nice to read about kayaking on Paddlewise from areas other than North America. I also think your story provided some good examples about what can go wrong while sea kayaking. It sounded like the crossing shouldn't have started in what were already poor conditions. It also sounded like there were some paddlers (not you but the ones who capsized) who didn't have the skills for crossings but probably went because they felt the others could keep them out of trouble. Don't get me wrong, I am an advocate of hard-core paddling, but only when all of the paddlers are up to the challenge and have the right conditions, which was not the case here. While the story was well written, entertaining and educational, it was also a poor example of proper sea kayaking. I hope others learn from it that a group is only as strong as its weakest paddler and that one should never depend on a group to keep him or her out of trouble. Duane *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi you all, Duane wrote: > Don't get me wrong, I am an advocate of hard-core paddling, but only when all > of the paddlers are up to the challenge and have the right conditions, which > was not the case here. While the story was well written, entertaining and > educational, it was also a poor example of proper sea kayaking. I think bad situations make good examples ;-) I do hope you enjoyed the pics... after all, I DID enjoy the crossing, in spite of various worrying things. A. *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
In a message dated 11/1/01 11:26:57 AM, Strosaker_at_aol.com writes: << I hope others learn from it that a group is only as strong as its weakest paddler and that one should never depend on a group to keep him or her out of trouble. >> Good lesson to remember, especially when we want to take our less skilled friends out to help them fall in love with kayaking. <<We, Markku and I, rescued the kayaker who had capsized first three times during that afternoon. He seemed to have a lot of trouble with the stability in his plastic single, which was noticeable too light. First we used the method described above, with the hand pump, but the pumping seemed to take a lot of time and precious energy even if there was two people taking turns at pumping. The next two rescues were modified x-rescues, where the bow of the light but water-filled kayak was only slightly taken onto the deck of our supporting double, just to let the water out from the cockpit. We finished the rescue with the hand-pump, after the capsized kayaker had climbed back to his single from the space left between the kayaks. I was keeping the bows towards the waves and supporting with the stability, and Markku was giving directions behind my back and helping this mate to finish with his pumping.>> I'm in agreement with Duane, especially with the great quality of the trip report. I enjoyed it a great deal. I wonder about the paddling that is done in other places, though. Here in the Chesapeake Bay area we tend to be a bit obsessive about safety, as our friend Ralph has pointed out with some humor at times. Why choose to use any rescue that requires hand pumping the water out if it isn't necessary? I'm sure there was a reason, as you mentioned above, you "but water-filled kayak was only slightly taken onto the deck of our supporting double, just to let the water out from the cockpit." Does this mean you didn't empty it as much as you could? My experience with "t" or "x" rescues is that the boat is so empty that a sponge is a better tool to remove the last of the water rather than a pump. The unending conversation about rescues back here is about learning every variation on the theme of getting the paddler back into their dry boat as quickly as possible. Was there a concern for the temperature of the water or what? What is the emphasis in your neck of the woods? Do you have any kind of standard teaching? I know the Brits don't think much of the paddlefloat. Is there some particular thing you do or don't do? I don't think 22mph is that bad a wind, just a lot of work but is that 5'-7' sea normal? That could have been tough in that wind, though you didn't indicate was much of an issue. I've never been in seas that high so I don't know how tough they are. It sounds like your friend in the plastic boat felt too good in it. The paddling culture we paddle in seems to be different from region to region and even group to group. I find all of them interesting. Thank you for sharing yours. Joan Spinner *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
Hi P´Wisenheimers... Joan wrote (Nov 1st): ......... >Why choose to use any rescue that requires hand >pumping the water out if it isn't necessary? I'm sure there was a reason, as you mentioned above, you "but water-filled kayak was only slightly taken onto the deck of our supporting double, just to let the water out from the cockpit." Does this mean you didn't empty it as much as you could? My experience with "t" or "x" rescues is that the boat is so empty that a sponge is a better tool to remove the last of the water rather than a pump. Well, the kayak was rather heavy, so I do regard the "full" x-rescue is rather dangerous in those waves! We wanted to lift the kayak as much as possible, but not enough to cause any stability problems. What the people do not quite understand, is that the rescueing is actually heavy and sometimes dangerous thing also to the rescuers. After the x-rescue we had to get all of the water away from the kayak because it was making the plastic single very shaky. A bailer was not very helpful, and pumping took so much energy, so we ended up combining the best elements of the x-rescue and the hand-pump, which takes quite effectively the water from the bottom of the boat. Using sponge in those waves would not have helped. There would be more water coming in than getting out. > The unending conversation about rescues back here is about >learning every >variation on the theme of getting the paddler back into their >dry boat as >quickly as possible. Was there a concern for the temperature >of the water or >what? The Finnish paddlers were mostly well equipped with jackets and neprene suits, but if someone gets hypothermic (it was the end of June, remember!) after spending some hours in the sea-water, the temps were a matter of concern. The Estonian and Lithuanian competition paddlers were wearing sports jackets and t-shirts! Two of the capsized and floated several hours in the water. What is the emphasis in your neck of the woods? Do you >have any kind of >standard teaching? I know the Brits don't think much of the >paddlefloat. Is >there some particular thing you do or don't do? All the clubs have basic and advanced (the latter meaning expedition) courses for the beginners. All the beginners are strongly adviced to take the courses, but mostly they are from 3 to 5 days - and according to my experience the *real* school of life starts only after the classes ;-) The National Finnish association of kayaking has tried to create some official standards for the courses, but it is very much after the clubs to stay at the level. Our club does the courses very different than the next one in the neighbourhood, which emphasizes the rescueing techniques and group functioning (I do hope this was a correct term!). My club has mainly lone wolves who take all the responsibilities by themselves and paddle their trips mainly alone or in very small groups. A very private club in a way: we can not afford very many new members (about 200 of them now) because there is not space for them and their kayaks. > I don't think 22mph is that bad a wind, just a lot of work >but is that >5'-7' sea normal? That could have been tough in that wind, >though you didn't >indicate was much of an issue. I've never been in seas that >high so I don't >know how tough they are. It sounds like your friend in the >plastic boat felt >too good in it. He had maybe a good belief in his skills. The problem with the folks doing the crossing was that the organizer, Yrjo, had no possibilities to check all the inviduals taking part to it. So he had to trust the people coming from different clubs all over the country and trying to confirm him that they were all right. That was the reason why the safety boat was following us, it has not been used before during those crossings. The kayaking has become very popular during the last 6-7 years I have been paddling and more and more new-comers are starting every summer. THAT is a matter of concern, because they seem to be very optimistic about their skills. It is so easy to start here. The sea is open and free to everyone and the "everyman´s rights" support the campers providing free camping overnight to almost every place - excluding someones garden, naturally. This is heaven, if you do not pay attention too much to the water-temps... The wind did not feel bad. It was first the sharpness of the waves which got us wet, water crashing over board. After that it was pure sweat and the problems of balancing which took so much energy. > The paddling culture we paddle in seems to be different >from region to >region and even group to group. I find all of them >interesting. Thank you for >sharing yours. > >Joan Spinner Thank you all reading it! I did enjoy the crossing, it was my first over to Estonia. Yrjo and some other kayakers have done those crossings since -88 or something, when first the Russian gun-boats were following the kayakers to Tallinn all the time and they were not allowed to land anywhere except the Pirita harbour. The Estonians were under the Soviet regime that time. A legendary trip, I believe... with no peeing breaks, ha ha... Cheers, Ari *************************************************************************** PaddleWise Paddling Mailing List - Any opinions or suggestions expressed here are solely those of the writer(s). You must assume the entire responsibility for reliance upon them. All postings copyright the author. Submissions: PaddleWise_at_PaddleWise.net Subscriptions: PaddleWise-request_at_PaddleWise.net Website: http://www.paddlewise.net/ ***************************************************************************
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