Re: [Paddlewise] Danish dragon boat, some answers

Well Nick,

Can and should and do we move on and apply the question of how we as
individual paddlers, and maybe here in a collective discussion group at least,
think about how to overcome our own weaknesses? Well sure, that can be part of
this thread too, but making comments both general and specific about
leadership, responsibility, and accountability doesnt make one smug either,
okay?

Certainly though, comparing and contrasting lessons unveiled from the Danish
group-paddle dragon-boat incident with sea kayaking as we understand it,
especially the element of individual responsibility and risk management, is a
difficult task for me to do with any real practicality to my own paddling.

Let me go another route instead. I think of Beowulfs boast upon his arrival
in Dane-land with his little band of Geats on their mission to slay Grendel
for Hrothgar

Beowulf spake, bairn of Ecgtheow:
"This was my thought, when my thanes and I
bent to the ocean and entered our boat,
that I would work the will of your people
fully, or fighting fall in death,
in fiend's gripe fast. I am firm to do
an earl's brave deed, or end the days
of this life of mine in the mead-hall here."

Was this alleged Anglo-Saxon, fictional hero-of-old simply an arrogant
braggart, lacking humility while culpable of hubris yet unfathomed? Was the
boast evidence of a risk homeostasis that was way out of equilibrium with a
more adequate reflection that should have been rendered? Was Beowulf resigned
to a fatalistic outcome where death was as possible as success or at least a
death in fighting to the final end if it came to that? Or was Beowulf a superb
leader with superhuman skills and capabilities more than adequate for the task
at hand evidenced by his previous exploits?

I feel the latter is true and in fact Beowulf was showing his confidence while
knowing he could die  even if the statement was in a context of pride. As
invincible as a hero thinks they are, the story was told in a time of grim
irony when the hostility of nature and the uncontrollable forces of death were
a central theme affecting all of life.

We as sea kayakers have the right to express a confidence in our abilities to
put to sea in our vulnerable craft. We train, we equip, we experience and
grow, we learn efficiencies, we engage new levels of difficulty non-paddlers
cannot understand, and we hopefully estimate abilities commensurate to the
environment gaining expertise in the end that can only be exhausted by our own
stupidity or a fate we couldnt foresee or perhaps control. Wisdom can't be
taught but respect must be learned and maintained. We know this as a sure
thing.

We must however account for the consequences of each strategic and tactical
decision made, our values and frames of reference accounting for these
decisions. So it was with Beowulf, whose strength in honor and glory and
self-assertion was also his eventual undoing. His weakness was his strength.
Risk reduction, for me, comes from the realization of this weakness.

Cherrs,

Doug

> I don't see the benefit to anyone to be critical of a dead man.
> I know nothing about him, but I am sure he had no idea he was
> leading a potential death march. We can pin point all kinds of
> mistakes he made. And we can propose changes in law that may
> eliminate the potential of these particular mistakes. We can use
> his mistakes as object lessons for other leaders and be "sure"
> they never make those same mistakes.
>
> But there is something deep inside people that will ensure that
> other mistakes are made and other people die for other reasons.
> We can feel confident that we are wise enough to know that we
> will never make the mistakes made by this poor dead man, yet I
> am sure everyone of us makes decisions at least once every year
> that are similar in character but we have been lucky enough to
> avoid the same consequences.
>
> Some of us allow a less experienced kayakers come out with us
> when they probably shouldn't, just because we drove all the way
> to the put in and don't want to drive home without paddling and
> don't feel right about telling someone else to stay home when we
> want to go out. Some of us go for "short" hikes in the woods
> without spare cloths or any communications devices because we
> have gone for hundreds of hikes and nothing bad has ever
> happened and its just a short hike we don't need an annoying
> back pack. Some of us drive over the speed limit, because we
> were busy at home and left late and the kids need to get to
> their soccer game and we are safe drivers and have the driving
> record to prove it. Some of us go out for pizza on snowy
> slippery days because we don't feel like cooking, and we have 4-
> wheel-drive and anti-lock brakes and see our driving record
> above. Some of us go paddling even though our VHF battery is not
> fully charged because someone else must have a fully charge bat!
>  tery and the wind isn't that bad anyway. Some of us bring
> our neighbors kids sledding without helmets because we didn't
> wear helmets when we were kids and we survived and their mother
> didn't send helmets with them anyhow. Only you know the stupid
> things you do that could come back to bite you. Some of the
> things we do we don't even realize are stupid because, well, we
> are stupid.
>
> People are very good at rationalizing their need to get out
> there and set a new record in dragon boat. I have no idea what
> those reasons were in this particular case, but the drive to do
> so runs strong in humans. There is very little we can do to keep
> other people from creating that rationalization. I don't see
> much point in finding ways to keep other people from being
> stupid. I have enough trouble keeping myself from being stupid.
>
> So, the hard part of this kind of event is not coming up with
> lessons that others can use to protect themselves, the hard part
> is coming up with lessons we can use, knowing full well already
> that going out in a dragonboat with kids without immersion
> protection in nasty, cold weather is a bad idea. We know in
> detail the technical mistakes that were made in this case and
> are smug enough to feel we could teach the dead man something,
> yet we need to figure out a way that we don't make our own
> mistakes, yet still allow ourselves to have adventures and enjoy
> a sport that is risky every time we go out.
>
> Does anyone have any advice on how to overcome our own weaknesses?
>
> Nick
>
>
> On Feb 23, 2011, at 9:13 PM, Jackie Myers wrote:
>
> > Nick Schade wrote:
> >
> >> The leader in the dragon boat appears to have given up his
> PFD and thus his life in an effort to save his charges. To me,
> this indicates that the students were well served by trusting
> his leadership. Do we have any indications that the
> teacher/coaches took this adventure lightly? Obviously they did
> not take it seriously enough, but that is almost always the case
> when bad stuff happens. With a little more regard for dangers
> most accidents would not happen. With a little more regard for
> dangers most of us would not enjoy kayaking as much as we do.
> >>
> >
> > Imo, this discussion wasn't about a "little more regard for
> dangers.">
> > Your response came on comments made not about specific actions
> of this event but on the comments made by myself and Tony
> regarding blind trust placed by novices in their instructors and
> leaders as well as about unqualified, overconfident "trip
> leaders" who think they are qualified to lead a novice group
> into such conditions.
> > PaddleWise was established to be able to discuss these
> situations where hopefully paddlers can learn from them.
> > And for anyone who may have missed the specific actions, this
> is what I got from the information reported here about this
> incident....>
> > Two teachers with thirteen students were out to attempt "to
> set a new record," in heavy seas, "ice slabs floating freely" on
> the surface, water temps less than 36 degrees F, gusting wind,
> heavy seas, no wet suits or dry suits - apparently no means for
> signaling emergency - rescue coming in the form of a female
> student who somehow, after capsizing, managed to fight her way
> 500 meters against "heavy seas," fortunately reach shore and
> then run 1 km to a store to raise the alarm (contact SAR).
> >
> > When I see this, I think safety was not a primary
> consideration. I don't even think it was secondary.  In the
> case of instructors with students, my opinion is that safety
> should be the primary consideration, ahead of setting any new
> records.
> > As for giving up a pfd to a student who was in trouble, I
> would imagine the parents of that student would say that was the
> least the teacher could have done in a deadly
> situation.   I'm sorry it cost him his life.
> Even sorrier that someone didn't look at the situation
> beforehand and say "let's go for the record another day."
> I would like for paddlers to take from this the strength to say
> "no, I don't like the looks of this and you can call me chicken,
> but I'm not going."   Trip leaders need to be honest
> in evaluating their abilities in the given situation.  If
> he/she takes a group of students into the above conditions (as I
> read from the reports), they need to re-evaluate their
> leadership skills.  If they survive.
> > Jackie
> >
> >
>
> Nick Schade
>
> Guillemot Kayaks
> 54 South Rd
> Groton, CT 06340
> USA
> Ph/Fx: (860) 659-8847
> http://www.guillemot-kayaks.com/
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